Israel Must Stop

[Gettingfedup]

From Reuters 11.20.01:

>GAZA (Reuters) - Israel demolished Palestinian houses in Gaza >Tuesday and said it would build new homes for Jewish settlers >in the West Bank city of Hebron, a day after the United States >announced a new Middle East peace drive.

>Three Palestinians were wounded in the fresh violence in Gaza, >hospital officials said, underlining the difficulties U.S. envoys will >face when they arrive in the coming days to prod peace moves >forward.

>Israel also said it would replace mobile homes in the Jewish >settlement in divided Hebron with concrete houses, despite >Secretary of State Colin Powell's call to halt settlement >construction amid nearly 14 months of violence.

Again, Israel is pouring gasoline on the fire. Take note of Colin Powell's call to Israel to halt settlement construction. Will Israel heed this request? No. It's about time our administration has said enough is enough. I'm sick of my country (US) backing Israel while they continue to settle in Palestinian territories. Finally the international community is starting to look at this situation in a realistic manner. Israel must clean up it's act, or be isolated.

[Robert Furst]

Israel should have never tried to get the Arabs to stay in what is now Israel. But as guests they should learn to behave themselves or asked to leave.

[L@mplighterM]

I think gettingfedup should read his/her history books. Perhaps then he/she would get a handle at what's happening in Israel. Powell is not the one who is going to live among the Arabs, so who really cares what he says. I dont !!! It's easy to fix a problem at someone elses expense. Any of the western countries wouldn't put up with the palestinians ****.

[NewsGuy]

Originally posted by L@mplighterM
Powell is not the one who is going to live among the Arabs, so who really cares what he says. I dont !!!

Unfortunately, many people and governments care very much what Powell says.

[Wheelman]

He is right though... If the Canadians or the Mexicans were anything like the Palestinians we would kick their asses so fast the French wouldn't have time to sneer properly.

Screw Palestine... Isreal needs to put some arty in place and start shelling the crap out of them anytime they even think of making a suicide attack.

[humanitarian]

First of all, the reality of the situation, and any astute high school student can recognize this, is violence perpetuates violence. This FACT is not even debatable. As long as the state of Israel is content to keep its' repressive boot on the neck of Palestinian self-determination and sovereignty, you can expect more and more suicide bombings. And rightly so. Honestly, how would you react if the roles of this trite, juvenile, and potentially destructive situation were reversed? It's also indicative of a deadly malaise that someone like Sharon (who should be put on trial for crimes against humanity) can be lauded such that he is. As for equating the anti-racism conference with anti-semtism, that is just an absolutely absurd and racist self-defense mechanism in it's own right. Seriously, it's high time that Israel (and by this I am in no way referring to the average hard-working citizen) accepts even a minuscule degree of accountability. Everyone is SICK AND TIRED of living with a continual threat of large scale war. Sharon should swallow his arrogant pride and put an end to this madness so that the rest of us compassionate human beings can get on with real living. It's THAT simple.

[Wheelman]

Originally posted by humanitarian
First of all, the reality of the situation, and any astute high school student can recognize this, is violence perpetuates violence. This FACT is not even debatable.

That is quite possibly the most moronic opinion that I have ever seen someone try to pass off as fact. Violence does perpetuate more violence in some instances but in the case of complete annihilation it certainly does not.

I find it amazing that you destroyed your entire reply with your first two sentences.

[L@mplighterM]

Couldn't have said it better myself Wheelman. I think humanitairian article is BS. Dead men dont talk and I dont imagine they do much more. If Sharon was like Hitler, Stalin, Mao, etc. the Arabs wouldn't even fart. In any events they are a bunch of ****** cowards, all the old bastards are afraid to die, generally they leave that to the youth.

[Wheelman]

The Arab Palestinians would have all of us, especially those of us in the West, believe that they are just peace loving people, and that the Israelis, especially Ariel Sharon, are big bad monsters.

The truth is that if Ariel Sharon hacked every last Arab Palestinian in existence up into tiny pieces with a dull hatchet, he would look like a girl scout compared to the stuff the so-called peaceful Muslims have done.

Ask the Serbs. I hope we don't treat Israel the same way we treated them.

[humanitarian]

Wow, truly stunning. It seems I'm being attacked by a couple of pre-schoolers who cannot read. I said ' The reality of the situation.....' Referring, of course to this situation we are discussing, namely, the Israeli / Palestinian situation. And in this PARTICULAR instance, yes, violence does perpetuate violence. Actually, how long has this charade been going on for now? The fact that Wheelman can construe an objective statement as being a sweeping generalization is stultifying. Honestly dude, you have alot of gall to prattle on about moronic statements when you lack basic comprehension skills. And L@mplighter is right up there with you. I'm afraid I fail to recognize when exactly I compared Sharon to Hitler, Stalin, or Mao. I said he was a war criminal. Check the track record if either of you have any interest in the truth. Ridiculous.

[Wheelman]

Originally posted by caribakam
... BUT DOES HE HAVE THE MEANS? THE ONLY PEOPLE THAT PROFITTED FROM THAT ACT ARE THE ISRAELEES, CERTAINLY NOT THE ARABS.

Ah yes, the we're too stupid and poor to do such a thing defense. Israel lost more people in the trade center than they have in any one suicide bombing to date.

Wait, why am I even bothering to argue this point with you. Just shut up and take your medicine.

[Wheelman]

Originally posted by humanitarian
Wow, truly stunning. It seems I'm being attacked by a couple of pre-schoolers who cannot read. I said ' The reality of the situation.....' Referring, of course to this situation we are discussing, namely, the Israeli / Palestinian situation. And in this PARTICULAR instance, yes, violence does perpetuate violence.

Look at the slobbering moron calling me a "pre-schooler"!

Hey moron, the "reality of the situation" is that the violence that the Palestinians have seen thus far is not enough. They have the luxury of retaliating against a few missile attacks, yet they would not feel so froggy should they suffer a few weeks of shelling with some 155's or the proper deployment of a low yeild nuclear device. The IDF is a stronger fighting force than your own, Humanitarian. They can and should drive the Palestinians out of Israel and back to Jordan where they belong.

The "reality of the situation" is the Palestinian charter itself calls for the complete destruction of Israel. They teach their children to murder and pilliage Jews in the name of their god. Why should the Israelis show them quarter? Why they put up with the crap they do is a mystery to me.

The "reality of the situation" is that there is already a two-state solution and it has obviously failed. Jordan was created in 1922 as a state for the Arab Palestinians.

The "reality of the situation" is that Arabs are animals that cannot even live with themselves. Why should Israel have to accept rejects that aren't allowed in their own state?

Pardon me, Humanitarian, but don't start telling me your version of "reality" until you demonstrate a firm grip of it.

[humanitarian]

Hey, thanks. You've just succinctly demonstrated:
a) your ignorance
b) your racist tendencies

Also, I won't be posting here again. I was interested in meaningful, intelligent discourse, and I ain't seein' it. Your bigoted attitudes are a big part of the problem. **** off.

[L@mplighterM]

Is the coffee finished yet? I think it's fair to say that more than three quarters of Palestinians suppot the Hamas and other terrorist organizations. What makes their day is hearing that jews have been killed. At this point I think Arafat is senile and I dont think he knows what a bathroom is at this point. Clued out !!!He isn't the leader(not that I ever saw him as one) of nothing anymore as a matter of fact I dont think he even knows what the word means. I dont feel sorry for Arafat and as a matter of fact I think he should be put out of his misery. His own kind will most likely do him the favor one of these days, they've tried before.

Sharon is getting old and he keeps on repeating himself. I dont even know how many ultimatums he's given Arafat, I've lost count. At some point Sharon should figure that Arafat isn't listening. I dont know how he's viewed in Israel, I dont see him as a particular strong leader(still 1,000,000% stronger than Peres). It's easy to criticize someone, but really a few targeted killings and a few old vacant buildings does that even the score. The buildings looked to me like they were ready for demolition. At least Israel finally got the PR machine working.

Dont even ask what I would do because you dont want to know. Let me just say I don't take kindly to being stalked or living in fear.

Oh yeah! If you do come back for a peek humanitarian read your own statements and then go figure.

[aid]

Originally posted by humanitarian
And in this PARTICULAR instance, yes, violence does perpetuate violence. Actually, how long has this charade been going on for now? Ridiculous.

You have mentioned the word "violence" 3000 times. And Sharon 5000.

I am wondering if any history has taken place before Sharon.

Who wa the previous PM of Israel? And was there violence at that time?

How long has this charade been going on for now?

Over a hundred years of Arab terrorism and rejection, that's how long.

Your accusations ridiculous?

You bet.

[takeo]

Wow, some things I read in this discussion are of a kind of extremism which shows the fascist tendencies of some israeli and make Yorg Haider look like a schoolboy.

"Israel should have never tried to get the Arabs to stay in what is now Israel. But as guests they should learn to behave themselves or asked to leave."

You should reread your history. Jews came there as guests in the 20th century but soon the unwelcomed guests took over the complete house and treated the original inhabitants as ****. According to your theory the Jews should be asked to leave Israel.


"The IDF is a stronger fighting force than your own, Humanitarian. They can and should drive the Palestinians out of Israel and back to Jordan where they belong.
The "reality of the situation" is that Arabs are animals that cannot even live with themselves."

well, this doesn't need any comment, does it? if this isn't a call for etnc cleansing (or even genocide) and an extremely racist remark, i don't know what is.

[NewsGuy]

Originally posted by takeo
"The IDF is a stronger fighting force than your own, Humanitarian. They can and should drive the Palestinians out of Israel and back to Jordan where they belong.
The "reality of the situation" is that Arabs are animals that cannot even live with themselves."

well, this doesn't need any comment, does it? if this isn't a call for etnc cleansing (or even genocide) and an extremely racist remark, i don't know what is.

I agree that calling the Palestinians animals is racist, but keep in mind that 1 out of every 3 Palestinians, according to a recent Palestinian-conducted pole support the mass-murder of innocent Jews through acts of terrorism like the bombing of the Jerusalem pizza parlor.

In any event, asking that the Palestinians go to their first Palestinian state of Jordan (70% Palestinian) is of course not "genocide" nor "ethnic cleansing" as you and other Arab propagandists claim.

Perhaps you need to look up in the dictionary what genocide actually means. I'll give you a hint: It does not mean sending away Islamic terrorists out of reach of their victims.

Seems that every time someone suggests that the Palestinians be separated from their victims, you start yelling "genocide". Maybe this plays well in Muslim countries, but it is just an insult to the intelligence of civilized people who don't buy into Islamic terrorist propaganda.

[takeo]

newsguy, i thought you were the moderator? your views are as extremistic as the others and you even allow someone to make a very racist insult.
You call my opinion "propagandistic islamic lies" or something like that (even thought i'm of Jewish desendance and certainly no Muslim) because I think that sending away the original population of a conquered region is etnic cleansing (i agree genocide was a little exaggerated but it is surely one of the worst deviations of etnic cleansing) and because i think one can not punish an entire population for the crimes of a few terrorists. (this is exactly what hamas does, blaim all Israeli for the crimes of their leaders).
Jordania has a majority of Palestinians because these palestinians have been etnically cleansed from israel years ago. Originally jordan was the land of Bedouines (never saw the movy "Lawrence of Arabia" this guys were no paelstinians but nomads) as was saoudi Arabia and other Gulf states.
The Palestinians were the original inhabitants of what is now Israel and of the land occupied by Israel. Sending them away is not separation of the common grounds you share, this is something very different. Your logic to defend the total etnic cleansing of all Palestinians to claim to areas occupied by israel only for Jews is totally biased. This would be a criminal act, and one can never identify an entire population with terrorists, and certainly not if this terrorism has been caused by surpression and occupation, condamned by the entire world since the beginning. (and not because the entire world is anti-semitic, but because such acts are intolerable for any state to do, and are condamned by the geneva conventions, which of course, israel didn't sign) (only israel and some dictatorships in the third world didn't sign the Geneva-conventions, this may be a clue for you about how "democratic", "free" and "western" Israel really is...)

[aid]

Israel is not democratic.

The Arab states are.

[NewsGuy]

Originally posted by takeo
You call my opinion "propagandistic islamic lies" or something like that (even thought i'm of Jewish desendance and certainly no Muslim) because I think that sending away the original population of a conquered region is etnic cleansing (i agree genocide was a little exaggerated but it is surely one of the worst deviations of etnic cleansing)

Yes, I think that many of your opinions expressed here are directly from the Arab propaganda lines that are spreading like a disease across Europe these days, legitimizing vicious anti-semitism and drawing a moral equivalency between Islamic terrorists and their Jewish and Christian victims.

I have met many self-hating jews, and I am not here to pass judgement on whether you are or are not one of these unfortunate individuals. I would say, however, that solely based on your views that you expressed here, I believe that you are just repeating Arab propaganda without regard to fact or fiction.

For example, now you admit that you may have "exaggerated" when you accused Israel of genocide. That's a good start...

Next we'll work on the "ethnic cleansing" and start realizing that separating Islamic terrorists from their victims is not ethnic cleansing at all. It is the beginning of sanity.

But there is indeed ethnic cleansing that is going on with the Islamic extremists shooting at Israeli motorists, blowing up Israeli pizza parlors and bombing Israeli discos filled with teens. Additionally, the constant firing of RPG missiles into Israeli towns and into Israeli schools and community centers with the goal of driving the Jews into the sea is, actually, ethnic cleansing. I hope that the Muslim extremists are made to pay a very high price for their crimes against humanity.

[L@mplighterM]

Hey takeo my kid read some of your posts, then he told me there's some Arab on there posing as a jew.

You can't even fool a kid.

[takeo]

Lomlighter, that says more about the racist education (indoctrination) you gave your children, instead of learning them to think for themselves. They see some opinion that differs from what they have been told day after day and think "it must be the ennemy". At the children one can best recognise the parents.

Aid , Israel is not a democracy, nor are its Arab neighbours, no single country in the Middle East is truly democratic and free.

"
Next we'll work on the "ethnic cleansing" and start realizing that separating Islamic terrorists from their victims is not ethnic cleansing at all. It is the beginning of sanity. "

It will always remain etnic cleansing, it happened in 1948, in 1967(there was not a single terrorist act that provoqued that Israeli aggression) and could repeat in 2002, at least if Sharon and you guys would decide. But it could as well become genocide if the army continues to shelter palestinian refugee-camps and murdering children.


"But there is indeed ethnic cleansing that is going on with the Islamic extremists shooting at Israeli motorists, blowing up Israeli pizza parlors and bombing Israeli discos filled with teens. Additionally, the constant firing of RPG missiles into Israeli towns and into Israeli schools and community centers with the goal of driving the Jews into the sea is, actually, ethnic cleansing. I hope that the Muslim extremists are made to pay a very high price for their crimes against humanity"

So a few Israeli casualties of suicide bombers can be called ethnic cleansing ( the final goal is etnic cleansing) or launching rockets at Israeli settlements (illegal settlements, who should have been removed and had been stolen from the palestinians over the last 30 years, houses of Palestinian civilians have been destroyed to build this settlements) is etnic cleansing, but taking revenge on a whole population with many more deaths as a consequence isn't etnic cleansing? And removing the entire population of areas they inhabited for 1000's of years isn't etnic cleansing? only a few hardline Israeli extremists really believe that, you don't have to be an Arab or Muslim to see that this are lies. Someone who is not a criminal does not take reprisals at the entire civilian population, by doing that you are no better than Hamas.
And if according to you I'm a traitor to the Jewish cause because i can't accept this, than i prefere to be a traitor.

[aid]

than i prefere to be a traitor.

All traitors prefer to be traitors.

This is why they are traitors.

[L@mplighterM]

Takeo I dont beat my kids to believe in anything. Actually my kids have free will, I do know you Arabs brainwash and beat your children. Not only do I know but so does almost every jew even that great statesperson Golda Mier knew. There's a quote regarding that subject attributed to her but I can't quite remember it.

I've read all your BS on sites put up by Arabs pretending to be jews. If anyone thinks I'm wrong you can find the links at the JDL site.

All that comes out of your mouth is pure **** and I know even you dont believe it.