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varian
02-26-2008, 12:02 PM
Some analysts suggested that America's Trident boomers were one of the final nails in the coffin of the arms race with the USSR. Since one of India's arch enemies is Pakistan, a missile capable submarine would pose a very significant counter punch should hostilities break out again between the two nations. Pakistan may have to think about adding anti-sub warfare to counter this threat. Everyone is beating their plows into swords!!!

India tests underwater missile
Tue Feb 26, 8:11 AM ET

India tested a nuclear-capable missile designed to be launched from a submarine, in a move aimed at expanding India's ability to respond in case of a nuclear attack, officials said Tuesday.

It was unclear if the testing was successful.

"We are still awaiting reports from the testing site," said Gen. Umang Kapoor, a spokesman for the state-run Defense Research and Development Organization, which carried out the test.

The missile has a range of 435 miles and was test-fired from an underwater platform immersed in the Bay of Bengal. India is building a nuclear-powered submarine expected to start sea trials next year. It would be able to launch ballistic missiles.

Submarine-launched ballistic missiles would give India second strike capabilities if its land- or air-based weapons were disabled.

India's current crop of missiles includes the short-range Prithvi ballistic missile, the medium-range Agni and Akash missiles, the anti-tank Nag and the supersonic Brahmos missile, developed jointly with Russia.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080226/ap_on_re_as/india_missile_test

Bheeshma
02-26-2008, 12:24 PM
I am willing to bet pakis will try to et a couple of decommissioned OHP from US. China is lagging in Anti sub and French gear is too pricey for them.

varian
02-26-2008, 01:10 PM
China excels in quiet fast attacks and has very stealthy boomers. The Ruskies were no slouches in this area either. If Russia is helping with missiles, then they may be helping with India's new boomer too. Remember that China, Russia, and India have that agreement for joint space exploration. Because of India's large population, they have become a very valuable ally of the two Communist regimes.

An example of Chinese sub stealth:
... In late 2006, one of China’s new Song-class conventional submarines remained undetected as it shadowed the American aircraft carrier Kitty Hawk off the coast of Okinawa, Japan, although the exact details of the encounter remain the subject of continuing debate. It then surfaced well within torpedo range.

To some China experts in the United States military, that was an aggressive signal to Washington that China could challenge the United States Navy in waters around Taiwan. It also showed that Chinese submarine technology had advanced more rapidly than some experts had expected.

“The U.S. had no idea it was there,” said Allan Behm, a security analyst in Canberra, Australia, and a former senior Australian Defense Department official. “This is the great capability of very quiet, conventional submarines.” ...

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/25/world/asia/25submarine.html?ref=world

I spent nearly three years on the Hawk, and after its last Viet Nam cruise in the '70's it went through a retrofit in Hunter's Point (now defunct) San Francisco and emerged as a CV, indicating its new role as an anti-sub warfare carrier. That doesn't mean that it couldn't take part in air strikes, but rather that its main focus was ASW. It is reputed to have 'bumped' (it's a game they play) Russian subs more than once, and a Chinese sub at least once, but this last event was a complete surprise. US Intel may have fallen down on the job again. Anyway, either the Chinese or the Russians are capable of helping India along in the area of quiet, stealthy submarines. Both the Kitty Hawk CV 63 and its sister ship the USS Constellation CV 64 were being considered for decommissioning prior to the present Iraq war. They were originally commissioned around 1959.

Bheeshma
02-26-2008, 05:11 PM
I am sorry China does not have stealthy boomers. Heck there nuke subs hardly dare to venture out from their coast. Here is anarticle regarding their Boomers.
http://www.fas.org/blog/ssp/2008/01/chinese_submarine_patrols_rebo.php

Their latest diesel electric subs have improved greatly but that is mainly due to help from Russia. Aain India and Russia have a space exploration pact, china is not involved. Similarly India has pacts with NASA and Europe. I did read the article you mentioned but find it strange that a relatively new sub decided to surface and expose itself instead of retreating safely once it had penetrated the carriers defenses.

varian
02-27-2008, 12:52 AM
I stand corrected on the boomers, but there is always a cat and mouse game about how close a sub can get without being detected. A carrier group usually includes two to three other vessels that may also pick up contacts. The bumps in the past were to show that sonar knew they were there. By surfacing, the sub may have been hot dogging it similar to the Chinese pilot who 'shot himself down' (figuratively) while playing with a Navy EP3 recon plane. It may have just been a 'cold war' type of game since nobody would have been allow to fire upon the sub any move was safe. It was probably more of an 'in your face' gesture.