Demoniztion of Israel and anti-Semitism

[aid]

The Deputy Foreign Minister Rabbi Melchior eloquently expressed the idea:

"Speaking at a press conference held at the Foreign Ministry in Jerusalem, Melchior explained that anti-Semites have in past months launched an intensive hate campaign, making a demonized version of the state of Israel the center-piece of their cause. Anti-Semites have used all available means, including television, international print media, internet, United Nations agencies and academic campuses, Melchior added. In his view, the recent activity has given support to anti-Israeli forces, and also reinforced traditional, anti-Semitic conceptions.

Arab states, extremist Palestinians and militant Islamic organizations are largely responsible for the recent surge of anti-Semitism, claimed the deputy Foreign Minister. The anti-Israel backlash at the Durban conference some months ago was no coincidence, said Melchior; more such gatherings can be expected in the future."

http://www.haaretzdaily.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=114424&contrassID=1&subContrassID=0&sbSubContrassID=0

We see examples of hateful Arab or pro-Arab propaganda even on this forum. The demonization of Israel proceeds on all fronts and is accompanied by anti-Semitic campaigns, especially in Europe, and especially in France and Belgium. The Arabs have expanded the battlefield to Europe, which they are currently assidiously occupying.

As a result, Israel is even expecting some new alia from France as was reported by the JP.

It has become apparent today, as never before, that anti-Zionism and anti-Semitism are just two different words for one and the same phenomenon.

[NewsGuy]

gee... I was about to upload this very same piece of news.

Thanks.

[takeo]

as i explained a zillion times before, anti-semitism and citicism towards the policy of Israel are two completely different things, and people attacking Israeli policy are usually the same fighting fascism and racism directed against any people, be it the Jews, arabs, or others.
People do not criticise Israel because they hate jews but because they think Palestinians have rights too as human beings and as a people. They would do exactly the same if the roles would be inversed and most of them as well strongly condamn the attacks against innocent Jewish civilians.
if Sharon would have been Arab and the Palestinians would have been Christians or Turks the reaction would have been exactly the same.

[takeo]

the leaders of Israel just use this word "anti-semitism" for not having to respond to any difficult questions and critics about the Israeli policy. In that way they ridiculise the word "anti-semitism" and real nazi anti-semits who hate Jews as a people are no longer differenciated from people who criticise israeli policy.

[NewsGuy]

Originally posted by takeo
as i explained a zillion times before, anti-semitism and citicism towards the policy of Israel are two completely different things, and people attacking Israeli policy are usually the same fighting fascism and racism directed against any people, be it the Jews, arabs, or others.

In this regard, your views are very naiive and mistaken. At this point in time anti-Israeli views are almost exactly equal to anti-semitism, even though there is a theoretical difference between them.

And who are the noisiest anti-Israel spokespeople? First and foremost Islamic extremists and Neo-Nazis, as well as a handful of pseudo-intellectual left-wing extremists.

Exposing anti-semitism is no excuse to avoid responding to tough questions. It is often the true underlying reason for anti-Israel rhetoric.

However, turning to the usual Arab and Nazi accusations against the Jewish victims of Arab terrorism and parroting words like "ethnic cleansing," "genocide," "apartheid" and other such silly soundbytes is the way that anti-semites and misguided left-wing lackies avoid looking at the truth:

The ethnic cleansing is the national aspiration of many Arabs who seek to mass murder all Israelis. Genocide is the main startegy of Islamic terrorists, and apartheid is what the Arabs have created with their terrorism and refusal to accpet Israel's basic right to exist.

I don't believe that people can hate the only Jewish country in the world, without hating the citizens of that country.

I am sorry to be harsh and don't mean to offend you personally, but please realize that in the end, there is no place on the face of the earth where extremist Islam exists without attempting to slaughter all their non-Muslim neighbors, purely on the basis of religious hatered.

Do you really want your views to be associated with that crowd?

[takeo]

"In this regard, your views are very naiive and mistaken. At this point in time anti-Israeli views are almost exactly equal to anti-semitism, even though there is a theoretical difference between them. "

There is more than a theoretical difference between them. People protesting against the blockade of palestinian cities and the shooting of stone-throwing children and the illegal occupation are NOT the same people who think that Jews are an inferior people. Both in theory and in practice

"And who are the noisiest anti-Israel spokespeople? First and foremost Islamic extremists and Neo-Nazis, as well as a handful of pseudo-intellectual left-wing extremists. "

that is bullshit. The Un isn't an organisation controlled by neo-nazi and Islamic extremists, nor is France nor is the Palestinian Autority.

"Exposing anti-semitism is no excuse to avoid responding to tough questions. It is often the true underlying reason for anti-Israel rhetoric. "

"exposing anti-semitism" is just propaganda to get away with critics to mesures that wouldn't be acceptable for any country in the world. (occupation", bombing civilians, etc.)

"However, turning to the usual Arab and Nazi accusations against the Jewish victims of Arab terrorism and parroting words like "ethnic cleansing," "genocide," "apartheid" and other such silly soundbytes is the way that anti-semites and misguided left-wing lackies avoid looking at the truth: "

those terms are never used by Islamists and nazi's who themselves advocate or are guilty of "apartheid", "genocide" "ethnic cleansing". They are used by people who are the victims of this policy and by people who always criticize such acts, no matter who is the perpetrator (Morocco in Southern Sahara, Iraq and Turkey in Kurdistan, in south-Africa, ... it are the same people who condmned this who today criticize Israel). Israel has conducted apartheid(you did confirm it, but blaimed the Arabs for this Israeli policy) and ethnic cleansing(see the other forums, refusing to allow people who lived there for centuries back on base of their etnicity is etnic cleansing, I'm sorry but that's how it is called). It hasn't (yet) conducted genocide.

"The ethnic cleansing is the national aspiration of many Arabs who seek to mass murder all Israelis. Genocide is the main startegy of Islamic terrorists"

yes this is correct (but only a minority of palestinins think so, and only after decades of israeli occupation and palestinian suffering)

"I don't believe that people can hate the only Jewish country in the world, without hating the citizens of that country. "

your beliefs are wrong, people can hate a state, the ideas behind a state, but not its citizens (for example many Americans hated the SovietUnion, but that didn't mean they hated each and every Russian, I hate the policy of the US and of Israel, but have many Israeli and American friends)

"I am sorry to be harsh and don't mean to offend you personally, but please realize that in the end, there is no place on the face of the earth where extremist Islam exists without attempting to slaughter all their non-Muslim neighbors, purely on the basis of religious hatered. Do you really want your views to be associated with that crowd?"

You are right about Islamist extremism, but that doesn't mean that all muslims or even a majority are extremists and that all Palestinians are extremists. Of course I don't want to be associated with them as I really hate those people, but i have no problems being associated with moderate Palestinians who just demand their rights as human beings and a people and being associated with Muslims in general.
It is also not because I'm a Jew that they have the right to associate me with Sharon (what i always say to my Arab friends)

[Semsem]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by takeo
[>>B]as i explained a zillion times before, anti-semitism and citicism towards the policy of Israel are two completely different things, <<

Takeo you are full of bull. I lived in France and the majority of Israel bashing is caused by traditional French antisemitism and an antisemitic French media.

The fact that French Courts do nothing to the French who attack Jews is more evidence of antisemitism.

[Semsem]

>>the leaders of Israel just use this word "anti-semitism" for not having to respond to any difficult questions and critics about the Israeli policy. In <<

Let's see. France and Europe / Eurobia criticise Israel for killing Sheik Yassin because he is a religious leader in a wheelchair. How can we respect European criticism when it basically tells Jews that they are not allowed to defend their people.

[abu afak]

Originally posted by takeo

that is . The Un isn't an organisation controlled by neo-nazi and Islamic extremists, nor is France nor is the Palestinian Autority. ...

The Palestinian Authority isn't controlled by [neo nazi] Islamic Extremists?
What do you call Arafat/the Al-Aqsa Brigades/Fatah etc?


Originally posted by sakeo
There is more than a theoretical difference between them. People protesting against the blockade of palestinian cities and the shooting of stone-throwing children and the illegal occupation are NOT the same people who think that Jews are an inferior people. Both in theory and in practice..."


SAY WHAT? ANTI-SEMITES?
WHO, US ANTI-ZIONISTS?

By Steven Plaut

Say What? Anti-Semites? Who, us anti-Zionists? US? We have nothing against Jews as such. We just hate Zionism and Zionists. We think Israel does not have a right to exist. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such. Heavens to Mergatroyd. Marx Forbid. We are humanists. Progressives. Peace lovers.

Anti-Semitism is the hatred of Jews. Anti-Zionism is opposition to Zionism and Israeli policies. The two have nothing to do with one another. Venus and Mars. Night and Day. Trust us.

Sure, we think the only country on the earth that must be annihilated is Israel. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

Sure, we think that the only children on earth whose being blown up is ok if it serves a good cause are Jewish children. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

Sure we think that if Palestinians have legitimate grievances this entitles them to mass murder Jews. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

Naturally, we think that the only people on earth who should never be allowed to exercise the right of self-defense are the Jews. Jews should only resolve the aggression against them through capitulation, never through self-defense. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

We only denounce racist apartheid in the one country in the Middle East that is NOT a racist apartheid country. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

We refuse to acknowledge the Jews as a people, and think they are only a religion. We do not have an answer to how people who do NOT practice the Jewish religion can still be regarded as Jews. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

We think that all peoples have the right to self-determination, except Jews, and including even the make-pretend Palestinian "people". But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

We hate it when people blame the victims, except of course when people blame the Jews for the jihads and terrorist campaigns against them. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

We think the only country in the Middle East that is a fascist anti-democratic one is the one that has free elections. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

We demand that the only country in the Middle East with free speech, free press, or free courts be destroyed. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

We oppose military aggression, except when it is directed at Israel. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

We really understand suicide bombers who murder bus loads of Jewish children and we insist that their demands be met in full. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

We think the only conflict on earth that must be solved through dismembering one of the parties to that conflict is the one involving Israel. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

We do not think that Jews have any human rights that need to be respected and especially not the right to ride a bus without being murdered. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

There are Jewish leftist anti-Zionists and we consider this proof that anti-Zionists could not possibly be anti-Semitic. Not even the ones who cheer when Jews are mass murdered. These are the only Jews we think need be acknowledged or respected. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

We do not think murder proves how righteous and just the cause of the murderer is, except when it comes to murderers of Jews. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

We do not think the Jews are entitled to their own state and must submit to being a minority in a Rwanda-style "bi-national state", although no other state on earth, including the 22 Arab countries, should be similarly expected to be deprived of its sovereignty. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

We think that Israel's having a Jewish majority and a star on its flag makes it a racist apartheid state. We do not think any other country having an ethnic-religious majority or having crosses or crescents or "Allah Akbar" on its flag is racist or needs dismemberment. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

We condemn the "mistreatment" of women in the only country of the Middle East in which they are not mistreated. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

We condemn the "mistreatment" of minorities in the only country in the Middle East in which minorities are NOT brutally suppressed and mass murdered. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

We demand equal citizen rights, which is why the only country in the Middle East in need of extermination is the only one in which they exist. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

We have no trouble with the fact that there is no freedom of religion in any Arab countries. But we are mad at hell at Israel for violating religious freedom, and never mind that we are never quite sure where or when it does so. But that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

So how can you possibly say we are anti-Semites? We are simply anti-Zionists. We seek peace and justice, that's all. And surely that does not mean we have anything against Jews as such.

[Semsem]

[<<In this regard, your views are very naiive and mistaken. >>

Takeo like a true Frenchman and European / Eurabian you are condescending.

<<People protesting against the blockade of palestinian cities >>

Takeo mon cher ami have you ever tried to understand why there is a blockade of Palestinian cities? Ding dong Takeo: Palesinian suicide bombers are entering Israel to kill Jews. But for you Jewish life is cheap and worthless. You are a Jew so you say. It is obvious that as all French Jewish self haters you are INSECURE in France and by bashing your own people you think you will be accepted into French society. You want to be more French than the King. You want to be LOVED by yor French goyim friends and your French Arab friends as you told us that you have Arab "friends." I am sure they LOVE YOU TAKEO.

<<and the shooting of stone-throwing children<<

Here again you lie and distort the truth. Among the children are Palestinians with guns shooting at Israeli troops. Israel does not have a policy of killing children. However the Palestinians have a policy of purposefully blowing up Jewish women and children. This is one more example of BLOOD LIBELING and DISTORTION OF FACTS.

And now tell us about the 1 million Algerians you French murdered and massacred in Algeria. You HYPOCRITES!

<<and the illegal occupation are<<

The illegal Israeli occupation? Ding dong! Israel was forced to attack Egypt in 1967 and Jordan attacked Israel. Israel did not go out to occupy this land.

Ding dong Takeo; Israel offered a reasonable peace treaty witnessed by President Clinton and Arafat refused to accept it.

>>that is . The Un isn't an organisation controlled by neo-nazi and Islamic extremists, nor is France nor is the Palestinian Autority. <<

Takeo it is you who are full of . Yes the UN is an antisemitic Jew bashing organisation controlled by Europe and the Islamic countries.

>>"exposing anti-semitism" is just propaganda to get away with critics to mesures that wouldn't be acceptable for any country in the world. (occupation", bombing civilians, etc.) >>

Here again you distort facts. You basically forget how Israel ended up occupying this land. You also ignore that 1,000 Jews have been murdered by suicide bombers. To you Jewish life does not count. You basically deny Jews the right to DEFEND THEMSELVES. You mon cher ami are a good example of the NEW EUROPEAN ANTISEMITISM denying the Jews the right of SELF DEFENSE by lying that it is "against international law" and avoiding the reasons for Israeli actions.

However as you are Jewish yourself you are a self hating Jew; which is worse than an antisemite.

>> Israel has conducted apartheid(you did confirm it, but blaimed the Arabs for this Israeli policy) >>

In what way has Israel conducted apartheid? There are 1 million Arabs who are ISRAELI CITIZENS with equal rights who are represented in the Israeli Parliament. I envy them. As a Jew from an Arabic country, who was forced to flee, they are treated 1 zillion times better than we Jews who lived in the Arab countries.

<<and ethnic cleansing(see the other forums, refusing to allow people who lived there <<

Takeo? ETHNIC CLEANSING? 1 million Jews were forced to flee from the Arab countries. That is ETHNIC CLEANSING.

Now mon cher ami PROOVE that Israel is doing ethnic cleansing. Give us some examples?

>>It hasn't (yet) conducted genocide. >>

Oh Takeo you are so sweat. No Jews have never committed GENOCIDE but FRANCE COMMITTED GENOCIDE by murdering 70,000 Jews and trying to murder 300,000 Moroccan Jews.

France also committed genocide in Algeria. You are a hypocrite et un mal honete on plus!

<<palestinian suffering)>>

The Palestinian suffering is no fault of Israel. Arafat could have had a country 3 years ago and they could have had a country in 1948 had they not attacked Israel. And in 1967 had they been willing to discuss peace.

>>your beliefs are wrong, people can hate a state, the ideas behind a state,>>

TAKEo: .

>>I hate the policy of the US and of Israel, but have many Israeli and American friends)>>

Oh so you are JEWISH???? A typical French self hating Jew. My cousin who lives in France told me that 25% of French Jews think the way you do. You do it to save yourselves as you want to show how French you are. It won't save you.

[<<It is also not because I'm a Jew that they have the right to associate me with Sharon (what i always say to my Arab friends)>>

Ah BRAVO MON CHER TAKEO. You have Arab friends. Wow I am really impressed. And now that you have bashed Israel I am sure you are popular with all your French goyim friends too. MAZELTOV. You, your children and grandchildren will never have to leave France ever. Now you can feel more secure and accepted into French society. Your future is now fully secured.

My mother fled Nazi Germany to Palestine and I fled an Arabic country so we appreciate Israel and understand it's vital importance. You think you are so secure in France but one day you, your children or your grandchildren may need Israel. So be careful when bashing Israel unjustly and lying and distorting facts. You may need Israel one day. Now go eat your heart out.

You say you HATE AMERICA and ISRAEL. You should bless these two countries and had it not been for the USA you r family would have ended up in a chimney in Poland.

Again Takeo French Jew haters are WORSE THAN THE ANTISEMITES.

[Semsem]

>>It is also not because I'm a Jew that they have the right to associate me with Sharon (what i always say to my Arab friends)>>

Oh poor Takeo: embarassed by Israel and Sharon. Because of Israel poor Takeo will NOT BE LOVED by his French goyim and French Arab friends. He may be forced to flee his beloved France. I really feel very sorry for you Takeo. Maybe you should convert to Islam or Christianity to hide your shame of being a Jew. How embarassing. You are willing to sacrifice your people in Israel to protect you r future in France.

My cousin who lives in France today spoke to me about French Jews like yourself. Fortunately you represent 25% of the French population and not the majority. I lived in France and I know your type.

DEGOUTANT