Shots fired at Jewish School Bus near Paris

[L@mplighterM]

*

[L@mplighterM]

If you shoot at a School Bus I consider it an attempt to kill. I had a bullet pass through my front car window once and it's not a great feeling.

I guess Jewish School Busses in France has to carry banners from now on takeo.


"WE LOVE ARABS LONG LIVE ARAFAT"

Didn't you say takeo that you just have to show support???

[NewsGuy]

Just wanted to add this quote from takeo to this thread, not to pick on him, but to point out a view which people other than him also espouse, and which is completely false.

Here's the quote from the "European Hypocrisy and Racism" thread on this forum.


there is no anti-semitism among ordinary Frensh, only among Arabs(and in fact they have nothing against ordinary Jews, only against those who openly support facsism and racism, all the synagogues attacked belonged to rabbi's who gave unconditional support to the extremist policy of sharon).

I think it's obvious that the schoolchildren on the bus that was shot at weren't "openly supporting" any particular political ideology. They were "ordinary" kids in every sense, except that they are Jewish.

It reminds me of a typical self-delusion of many Jews who think that they will be spared from anti-semitic and other Arab attacks, if only these Jews will publicly oppose Israel's policies and try to promote the cause of the enemies of Israel.

This attack on the Jewish schoolchildren shows clearly that it makes no difference what your ideology may be. They hate you just the same because you are Jewish.

And btw - this is not just a French problem. In Los Angeles a few years ago a neo-nazi shot at Jewish children in a pre-school. The only differerence is that in France it has become apparently customary for governement officials to make public statements that encourage a new wave of anti-semitic attacks like the one we saw today.

One of the nicest things about Israel is that it is a place where Jews can defend themselves forcefully against those who would like to destroy Jews.

[L@mplighterM]

One of the nicest things about Israel is that it is a place where Jews can defend themselves forcefully against those who would like to destroy Jews.

That's correct.

[takeo]

No single frensh minister or official has ever called for or legitimised anti-semitic or even anti-Israeli violence. every racist crime in France is more severely punished than in any other European country and if the perpetrators got caught they will face long sentences. However the Frensh police won't bomb the Arab quarters of Paris, that's the difference with israeli policy. Such unfortunate acts happen because some people can't make the destinction between cruel Israeli government-actions and Jews in general. That's why Jewish demonstrations against Israel are important to show that Israel's retoric that an attack on israeli policy is an attack on all Jews around the world(and the inverse!) is false.
Any attack on civilians and certainly on children is despisable, of course there will always be extremists and real racists and anti-semites that will find any reason good enough to target Jews. the same for anti-arab racists who target Arab civilians.

[L@mplighterM]

Whatever

Seems to me it's somewhat difficult not to know the didfference between a school bus and the jewish government.

[takeo]

yes, this difference should be obvious and people responsible for it are criminals. (people shooting at children...)


"One of the nicest things about Israel is that it is a place where Jews can defend themselves forcefully against those who would like to destroy Jews. "

They can defend themselves forcefully by killing and destroying the lifes of other innocent people. This is not self-defense and not justice, this is war.
Israel is also a country were the victims of Jews don't have any right to defend themselves, in fact a country where you can only receive justice if you belong to one particular etnicity.
I prefere France where someone who kills or harms a Jew get the same punishment of someone who kills or harms an Arab.

[L@mplighterM]

I wouldn't be too sure about equal justice for all in France. Not only that cops might make a better effort to find someone depending on who the crime was directed at.

[takeo]

that is not true in France but, according to amnesty international and human rights watch, very true in Israel and the occupied territories.

[L@mplighterM]

Gees !!!!!!!!!! I always thought I was watching the sunset and now I find out it?s the haloes from all the politicians and the men/women in uniform.

[NewsGuy]

Originally posted by takeo
They can defend themselves forcefully by killing and destroying the lifes of other innocent people. This is not self-defense and not justice, this is war.

More Arab-style lies and disinformation. Stalin would be proud of this propaganda. Of course, not a shred of truth here.

When Israel destroys the Islamic terrorist infrastructure, it is self-defense against those suicide bombers would blow themselves up trying to massacre Israeli women and children at a shopping mall. I call Israel's action self-defense, and with good reason.

I also note that in the Arab suicide bombers used high-explosives packed with nails to murder and injure as many Israeli civilians as possible.

You can make all kinds of left-wing fancy speeches about how these Arabs should have all kinds of human rights and justice, but what you really mean is that the Arabs should have the right to continue to massacre innocent Israelis, the more the better, and that Israel should do nothing to defend themselves.

I think that when you become the target of French-Arab anti-semitism yourself, then you will think differently.

[L@mplighterM]

Israel is doing exactly what any nation would do, less if anything.

I'll tell you if the Arabs carried on in the US like they do in Israel they would be hunted down and excecuted. And I'll tell you I wouldn't count on a trial if I was tem.

One of the biggest mistakes made by jews was in my opinion the fact that not enough of them joined the resistance during the WWII.

Actually they should have started before Crystalnight.

Manufacturing explosives is a piece of cake, childs play you might say.

Please don't take this as critisim or construe it in any way to mean that they were in any way responsible for what happened. I also know that hindsight is everything.

Right now they are defending their homeland. If innocent people are hurt in the process it's not their fault.

I dont see the Palestinians marching for peace on the contrary they are demonstrating to show support for Arafat and his terrorists.

[Negev]

Originally posted by L@mplighterM
I dont see the Palestinians marching for peace on the contrary they are demonstrating to show support for Arafat and his terrorists.

That's right. The only thing we see the Palestinians ever marching for is the destruction of Israel and the killing of all Jews. It's the mentality of Jihad.

[takeo]

"Islamic terrorist infrastructure"
So Palestinian radio installation and airport is Islamic terrorist infrastructure? How can radio and an airport controlled by Israeli military be terrorist? Arafat and the PA aren't Islamist and aren't terrorists. the PA never conducted one single terrorist attack against civilians. But if tanks and occupation forces come to their territories(where israeli forces are not allowed to come according to Oslo) to destroy and kill than they have every right to defend themselves and kill the intruders.
In that case all public buildings in Israel are legitimate targets for Palestinians, as they are the possetion of a terrorist government that target civilians in an area that doesn't belong to Israel.
I think the only mistake Palestinians made is to wait untill the 80's to start uprising against the illegal occupation and to target innocent people instead of occupiers. They should have started resistance a lot earlier, as Jews and anti-fascists in Europe should have started resistance against the nazi's occupation a lot earlier. Of course palestinians show support for Arafat, he is the only one who cared for them during the hard years of Israeli oppression and brought the palestinian question back on the international agenda. he was also the one who wanted peace with israel on the condition the palestinian rights would be honored. Israel had a chance to achieve peace, but fascists considered that palestinian "Untermenschen" had no rights whatsoever, not on an own independant state, not the right to return to the land of their origin.
Unfortunately too many Jews didn't resist to this kind of jewish fascism and as the Germans in WWII they will have to face the consequences of this. one can't enslave other people and conquer other lands unpunished with the excuse of self-defense.
ps: i have never been faced with any kind of anti-semitism in france, not even in arab quarters. in fact my neighbour is a Tunisian Jew who is quite popular among Arabs in the neighbourhood because he is honest and kind, he isn't interested in politics and isn't racist against Arabs on the contrary to most Israeli. one will be treated the same way one treats other people, Israel seems to forget this.

[L@mplighterM]

You see it all through the eyes of an Arab I dont.

[NewsGuy]

Originally posted by takeo
So Palestinian radio installation and airport is Islamic terrorist infrastructure? How can radio and an airport controlled by Israeli military be terrorist?

Yes, the Palestinians have been broadcasting anti-semitic and anti-Israel messages, as well as incitement to violence and terrorism.

Since the average Palestinian is illiterate, they get most of their "news" and "information" from the radio. So it has a big impact on inciting the uneducated masses, which comprise most of Palestinian society.

The Palestinians were warned of incitement to violence through their media many times, and now they pay the price.

Secondly, the Palestinian airport was one of the rewards given to Arafat as a result of Oslo, when Israel prematurely and naiively believed that Arafat would stop terrorism. Since he didn't keep up his end of the bargain, Israel took his reward away.

[L@mplighterM]

That's correct News guy. Not only that, the media is restricted or barred entry in many cases when there's demonstations that the PA dosen't want the west to see.

One example of that was when the news of the destruction of the towers in NY reached the Palestinians there was celebrations on the street.

[takeo]

I try to see things trough the eyes of both sides, you have absolutely no pity or consideration whatsoever for the other side, that makes you blind for their suffering, which is a lot worse than the suffering of Israeli people and is the reason why they commit sometimes incomprehensible acts.
you blame them that they are uneducated, yet during all those years of occupation since 1967 Israel has done nothing to improve the school system, all the money since 1993 had to come from Europe. In fact, Intifadeh or no Intifadeh, Israel has never done anything for the Palestinian civilian population, except destroying villages to build new settlements.

"Yes, the Palestinians have been broadcasting anti-semitic and anti-Israel messages, as well as incitement to violence and terrorism.
Since the average Palestinian is illiterate, they get most of their "news" and "information" from the radio. So it has a big impact on inciting the uneducated masses, which comprise most of Palestinian society. "

I once listened to translations of such radio messages when i visited Gaza. it wasn't anti-semitic hatred, but it was indeed directed towards the occupier, what do you expect, do they have to praise Sharon for not being destroyed? It didn't call however for the destruction of Israel or even to shoot at soldiers, just it repeated the violations israel made, it broadcasted every israeli attack, etc. I heard also a lot of anti-arab hatred in the Israeli media, so according to you the Jerusalem Post is a legitimate target? Media can never be a legitimate target, never heard of free press?



"Secondly, the Palestinian airport was one of the rewards given to Arafat as a result of Oslo, when Israel prematurely and naiively believed that Arafat would stop terrorism. Since he didn't keep up his end of the bargain, Israel took his reward away."

So here you admit that destroying the airport has nothing to do with combatting terrorism but everything with a collective punishment of the palestinian population (by the way destroying radio facilities was as well such a collective punishment)




"That's correct News guy. Not only that, the media is restricted or barred entry in many cases when there's demonstations that the PA dosen't want the west to see.
One example of that was when the news of the destruction of the towers in NY reached the Palestinians there was celebrations on the street."

So what, is this enough reason to destroy it?
i heard the images of that boy next to his father that was shot from nearby by an israeli sniper were not on israeli television, and the israeli were really angry that such images weren't censored in the West as well.

[L@mplighterM]

Actually the boy wasn't shot by an Israli sniper he was shot by a Palestinian.

Freedom of the Press or Free Speach. Sorry that dosen't exist only in your dreams. Where exactly in the world do you have free speech???? Nowhere!!!!! The press dosen't even have free speech in America if it violates the law.

Not only that if you step on the wrong toes you can loose your press card. You ever heard of the word "Blacklisted"

So freedom of the press is just so much nonsense. Why dont you build your radio station and start broadcasting murderous filth and see what happens.

Listened to translations *GGGGGG* you most likely translated it. Don't you think I've read Palestinian garbage and listened to hateful lies and propoganda.

The so called Palestinians seem to have more money than they need. Buying ships and weapons costing millions of dollars.

I think you live in a dream world where you mix fantasy with dilluted reality.

Not only that you dont even know what racism means. I'll tell you there are three races and Arabs belong to the same race as Jews. Further, they are Caucasoids or what is generally known as the White Race.

So if I was white and called all potential arabs terrorists how could you call me a racist?????? You can't !!!!!!!!!!!

[takeo]

OK, so now we know that there isn't freedom of speach in the US. I will remember that next time someone is attacking communism because "there is no freedom of speach" (besides that was a serious failure of the regimes in the east)

"Actually the boy wasn't shot by an Israli sniper he was shot by a Palestinian. "

Of course, whatever.


"The so called Palestinians seem to have more money than they need. Buying ships and weapons costing millions of dollars. "

this ship was owned by a romanian and was in service of Israel for many years. It seems a torough international investigation is necessary about this matter!!! (of course israel won't accept this, as it would unviel the mossad-lies)

"I think you live in a dream world where you mix fantasy with dilluted reality. "

You do, a dream world where Israel is always the victim of anti-semitism and the whole world is planning to harm innocent Israel.

"Not only that you dont even know what racism means. I'll tell you there are three races and Arabs belong to the same race as Jews. Further, they are Caucasoids or what is generally known as the White Race.
So if I was white and called all potential arabs terrorists how could you call me a racist?????? You can't !!!!!!!!!!!""

Well, you just made yourself enormously ridiculous! You continue shouting that all Arabs are anti-semite racists , yet here you come to the conclusion that Jews belong to the same race as Arabs so that a Jew insulting Arabs can't be an anti-arab racist(and an arab can't be an anti-semite racist)! And so if nobody can call someone who also belongs to the same white race a racist, than of course Hitler wasn't a racist, right?

[L@mplighterM]

I forgot for a moment that all jews are not Caucasoids.

I've never called Arabs racists only anti-semetic.

Hitler was a hateful man to say the least and he was a racist and anti-semetic.

Arafat is anti-semetic like you.

[takeo]

Arafat nor the palestinians can be anti-semites because they are semites themselves!!!!!!(Arabs, Jews, Berbers all are semitic people)

[Negev]

Originally posted by takeo
Arafat nor the palestinians can be anti-semites because they are semites themselves!!!!!!(Arabs, Jews, Berbers all are semitic people)

Hahahahah!!!!

One of my favorite lines to excuse Arab hatred of Jews.

[takeo]

lomplighter started to excuse his hatred with this.

[L@mplighterM]

Clasical Arab response takeo *GGG*straight from the mouth of the UN. If I was to say how I really felt about Annan you could call me a racist.

[cerulean]

Here's an article from the NY Times:

http://www.nytimes.com/2002/02/26/international/europe/26FRAN.html?ex=1015390800&en=de96e669e2b9c9a3&ei=5040&partner=MOREOVER

[watcher]

Where else can Israel go after all this time being unwanted in all other countries but back into Israel... All of Israel not part of it! Since Israel is unwanted there, Israel is unwanted in the whole world so what else does Israel have to lose? Israel should move COMPLETELY back home regardless of world opinion, since world opinion is usually harsh and apparently would never get better. What can Israel lose by moving completely back home? These "palestinians" are showing no hope for acting civilized, so they don't need any land of Israel set aside for them anymore.

[Flame]

Finally came to my limit with Takeo... can't even force my eyes to read one more word of his. Takeo... what is wrong with you? Do you have a head injury? There are almost no words to describe the problem you have, but you are indeed a very sick individual, perhaps without a soul. Certainly, your takeo on reality is highly skewed and questionable. A true facist you are. Not a liberal, not open-minded, not logical, not very smart, not rational, not a Jew for sure, and definately not a nice or kind person at all.

Your ramblings are that of a common facist and I just can't read one more word... just like a parrot... loud, repetitive and meaningless.

[L@mplighterM]

I'll tell you flame he's just another sick Islamic Fundamentalist brainwashed by his mama and papa, typical reasoning from his kind.

[takeo]

"Finally came to my limit with Takeo... can't even force my eyes to read one more word of his. Takeo... what is wrong with you? Do you have a head injury? There are almost no words to describe the problem you have, but you are indeed a very sick individual, perhaps without a soul. Certainly, your takeo on reality is highly skewed and questionable. A true facist you are. Not a liberal, not open-minded, not logical, not very smart, not rational, not a Jew for sure, and definately not a nice or kind person at all.

Your ramblings are that of a common facist and I just can't read one more word... just like a parrot... loud, repetitive and meaningless."

Yes I know all arabs are criminals, animals and should be expulsed from "Eretz Israel" and everyone not agreeing with this statement is a fascist and an arab or paid by the arabs. In know your kind of people.
Sometimes i may sound like a parrot that's because always hear the same arguments that have been prooven false a 1000's of times but are nevertheless being repeated again and again because you actually don't have any other argiument to support your views.