Petition against French anti-Semitism

[aid]

Please sign a petition against the growth of French anti-Semitism:

https://www.wiesenthal.com/social/press/pet1.cfm?petid=16

[NewsGuy]

aid,

Thanks for posting this link.

I hope that this forum's nearly 5000 visitors (and growing rapidly) will take the opportunity to voice their message by signing the petition.

[aid]

Moderators:

Can this petition be made a separate topic?

[NewsGuy]

aid,

It is a separate topic already, as its own thread. But it would not be its own section, like "Israeli-Arab Conflict" or "In the News" because those are designed to eventually have hundreds of threads within them.

However, to give it more exposure, I will also copy it to the "Resources" section, which should be a good place for it.

If we start getting many petitions, then I would consider having a "Petitions" section.

Hope that helps.

[Vic]

Here is an even better french petition:

http://www.lapetition.org/index.php

[Erich]

Could someone clarify if we are talking about French Anti-semitism directed towards the 22 million Jewish Semites or the 270 million Arab, Maltese and Ethiopian Semites?

Thanks,

Erich

[elke]

Originally posted by Erich
Could someone clarify if we are talking about French Anti-semitism directed towards the 22 million Jewish Semites or the 270 million Arab, Maltese and Ethiopian Semites?

Thanks,

Erich

A good dictionary should be able to give you an answer

[Erich]

Elke,

I've been to the "good" dictionaries, some indicate hate against semites, some go with the popular, but grossly inaccurate use of the word to indicate just some of the semites. I guess it depends on which dictionary you use and your own personal stand on inaccurate uses of the language.
Some "good" dictionaries also publish popular definitions of words like "irregardless", but would you accept that non word into your vocabulary? Only if you wanted to broadcast your ignorance to the world.
Anti-Jewish and Anti-Zionist are much more specific and technically accurate use of the language, it's just sad that we couldn't banish those terms and the idiocy behind them along with them. The world would better off without many of the "Anti's"

[elke]

Having trouble with double negatives, are we Erich? :D

You are right: "anti-Jewish" would be a better term. "Anti-Zionist" is something else - the Naturei Karta are anti-Zionist, but they are not anti-Jewish. However, the commonly understood meaning of the term "anti-semitic" is "anti-Jewish".

I agree with you though: the world would indeed be a much better place if there were less "antis".

[James]

Originally posted by aid
Please sign a petition against the growth of French anti-Semitism:

https://www.wiesenthal.com/social/press/pet1.cfm?petid=16

I submitted my information and agree with petition!

[yehudi]

Present french anti-semitism is a legend made up by extreme- right zionists.

There is very very little anti-semitism in France.
As a matter of fact, French- anti arabism is infinitely stronger and getting rid of it is a priority.

I'm not saying antisemitism is dead in Europe, for example it is still a (sad) reality in Poland

Poland is the biggest US-following country in Europe.

[Miriam]

Originally posted by yehudi


There is very very little anti-semitism in France.
As a matter of fact, French- anti arabism is infinitely stronger and getting rid of it is a priority. Know of any reliable statistics (polls, violent incidents, etc.) on the subject? Thx in advance :)

[Am Yisrael]

BS there is hardly any anti-semitism in France. Last week a Jewish French student was beaten and had a star of david cut onto her arm by the attackers. Its one of those sad issues that most people are ignoring because it doesnt effect THEM yet. I know for sure one of the main causes of the popular rise of aliyah from France is due to growing anti-semitism. Here in Britain it seems that people are becoming less tolerant with Jews aswell. There isnt much people can do to tackle it except facing anti-semitism head on. Just remember that most anti-semites usually have small intelectual capacity and they are easy to "subdue". Its the people that continually create anti-semitic fabrication that should be dealt with more concerned action.

[yehudi]

I beg to differ.

You'll find many anecdotes like this, but racist crimes against arabs are much much more common. Actually jews are so well organized that as soon as there is an incident, the whole world is alerted. For example, the "rabbi who was stabbed" thing triggered a big demonstration and plenty of speeches by the politics and intellectuals (we are pretty good at making speeches in France, i guess you noticed).
As far as I know, from the shape of the wound, the police actually deduced that the rabbi "stabbed himself". But there was simply no one to comment on this... and I have no more follow-up on this.

Just try finding a job in France when you are arab.... you'll probably notice quite a difference with being a jew.

[Am Yisrael]

Originally posted by yehudi
[B]I beg to differ.

You'll find many anecdotes like this, but racist crimes against arabs are much much more common. Actually jews are so well organized that as soon as there is an incident, the whole world is alerted. For example, the "rabbi who was stabbed" thing triggered a big demonstration and plenty of speeches by the politics and intellectuals (we are pretty good at making speeches in France, i guess you noticed).
Oh yeah? and how often do you see a Mullah get stabbed? Well I know the statistics of anti-semitism is HIGH. In fact if you compare the amount of Jews in France to the anti-semititic attacks, it will be MUCH higher than comparing Anti-Muslim attacks proportionaly.

Just try finding a job in France when you are arab.... you'll probably notice the difference with being a jew.
Why are you an Arab? Or are you just presuming this is the case. Well actually (this starts a whole new topic) most Arabs in France are immigrants, and if you look at ANY immigrant population you will see a high unemployement among them. Jews in France are usually ones who have lived there for a few generations. The proportion of immigration by Jews to France is nothing compared to Arab immigration. Oh yeah and there is higher education and motivation among Jewish populations in Western countries compared to Arab or Muslim populations.

[yehudi]

Originally posted by Am Yisrael
Oh yeah? and how often do you see a Mullah get stabbed? Well I know the statistics of anti-semitism is HIGH.
Please give me the source for the stats (and not 'honest reporting' please). An anti-arab act will go totally unnoticed, while an anti-jew act will be in the media.

What I do believe is there was a sharp rise in antisemitism after the new intifada.
But this is actually due to stupid people thinking "all jews are sionists persecuting palestinians".

Antisemitism in France is rare too, simply because it is impossible to recognize a jew from a non-jew, while arabs have a different look.

Originally posted by Am Yisrael
Why are you an Arab? Or are you just presuming this is the case. Well actually (this starts a whole new topic) most Arabs in France are immigrants, and if you look at ANY immigrant population you will see a high unemployement among them. Jews in France are usually ones who have lived there for a few generations. The proportion of immigration by Jews to France is nothing compared to Arab immigration.
You are right with this demonstration.

But most arabs are second generation immigrants, so there are french by education. And a friend of mine did a study (using a nice log-linear approach) showing than being an arab gave you a handicap for your first job. The size of the handicap was equivalent to loosing two years of studies at a university (he did that study in the particular case of a 'poor' neighborood).

I persist in repeating the reality of antisemitism in France is hugely overrated by American media.

[Am Yisrael]

http://www.afsi.org/OUTPOST/2002JAN/jan3.htm

French ambassador to England Daniel Bernard's reference to Israel as "that ty little country" created a brouhaha because the story had so many striking elements. Coarse anti-Semitism in polite society. Incredible stupidity on the part of a diplomat who made the remark at a party whose hostess (Barbara Amiel) was Jewish, known as a strong supporter of Israel, and a columnist to boot. A silly attempt at coverup from the ambassador who said he intended only to refer to Israel as "geographically small." But the story underlines a much more important development: the spreading brushfire--helped mightily by a huge influx of Muslim immigrants--of European anti-Semitism.

France, with its long, sorry history of anti-Semitism, is back in the forefront. Writing in the Washington Times (December 23), Andrew Borowiec describes the combined impact of a viciously anti-Israel media, Arab violence, and Christian indifference. He quotes Olivier Guland, editor of the Tribune Juive (Jewish Tribune) who says the media "portray the Palestinians as victims and Jews as their torturers." During the intifada's first month (October 2000), there were more than 100 serious anti-Semitic incidents in France, from synagague arson to attacks on Jewish schools. Joseph Sitruk, the chief rabbi of France, said there were 350 attacks against Jews in France in 2001, "not counting thousands of Jews insulted every day." The outset of 2002 saw renewed synagogue bombings and attacks on Jews. There is "an attitude of siege" among many French Jews, writes Borowiec, who feel "the government is more concerned about the nearly 4 million Muslims [most of them Arabs from North Africa] living in France than about the fate of the Jewish community." French foreign policy does nothing to alleviate these concerns. It is France that recently insisted on keeping Hizbullah off the European Union's list of terrorist organizations, winning kudos from Lebanese Foreign Minister Mahmoud Hammoud: "This shows that Lebanon's attitude with regard to Hizbullah is being more understood in calling for distinguishing between terrorism that we condemn and resistance of which we are proud."

Belgium is becoming another hotbed of anti-Semitism. The government disclaims responsibility for the current "trial" in Belgian courts of Ariel Sharon for alleged war crimes (for failing to prevent the killings by Phalangists in the Sabra and Shatilla camps in 1982), but journalist Uri Dan writes in the Jerusalem Post that the government could easily see that the case was dropped and is "deliberately using this fake legal process as a whip in the hope of forcing Sharon to give in to European Union demands on behalf of Arafat." Moreover, observes Dan, the Belgian media "are frequently even more venomous and primitive than those in France in their attacks on Israel." Once again, the Muslims seek to translate rhetoric into action, with worshippers at a Brussels mosque urged to go out and "take vengeance against the Jews."

Even Denmark, the object of Jewish admiration and affection for saving its Jewish community from the Nazis, has succumbed to the infection. Mogens Lykketoft, Denmark's Foreign Minister, has described Israel's targeted killing of terrorists as the moral equivalent of the assassination of Israel's tourism minister Rehavam Ze'evi; announced that the killing of 20 Israeli teenagers outside the Dolphinarium did not change his opinion that it was Israel, not the Palestinians, which was responsible for the violence; and has called for EU economic sanctions against Israel. There have been repeated anti-Israel street demonstrations in Denmark, France and other European countries by Arabs and what economics professor Steven Plaut calls "Eurotrash."

[Am Yisrael]

Originally posted by yehudi
[B]Please give me the source for the stats (and not 'honest reporting' please). An anti-arab act will go totally unnoticed, while an anti-jew act will be in the media.
Is that report good enough? Maybe anti-arab acts are not usually shown in the media as often as anti-semitic attacks, but the media makes up for it by thrashing around biased reporting from Israel where plenty of other issues around the world could be shown that are much worse than in Israel.

What I do believe is there was a sharp rise in antisemitism after the new intifada.
But this is actually due to stupid people thinking "all jews are sionists persecuting palestinians".

Antisemitism in France is rare too, simply because it is impossible to recognize a jew from a non-jew, while arabs have a different look.
But the Nazis had their ways of finding out who were Jews. Come on... it isnt that hard to find out who are Jewish just by visual looks? Most attacks are against Hasidim and Synagogues where the terrorists have true means of distinguishing Jews to non-Jews.

[Mediocrates]

yehudi
What I do believe is there was a sharp rise in antisemitism after the new intifada.
But this is actually due to stupid people thinking "all jews are sionists persecuting palestinians".

So there's a good reason to beat up Jews then?


Antisemitism in France is rare too, simply because it is impossible to recognize a jew from a non-jew, while arabs have a different look.

Blockhead! It's the Orthodox who are being attacked!