Israelis Seek to Build Physical Barrier in West Bank (NYT)

[cerulean]

http://www.nytimes.com/2002/05/07/international/middleeast/07FENC.html

From the article:
...

After years of opposing a West Bank fence, Mr. Sharon has incorporated one into his proposal to set up Israeli army-controlled "buffer zones" through swaths of the West Bank. Under a plan approved by Mr. Sharon's cabinet on April 14, a series of fences, sensors, ditches and barriers would roughly follow the 1967 border delineating the Israeli-occupied territories, but Israeli officials insist that it will not mark a de facto political border.

Defense Minister Benjamin Ben-Eliezer already announced on April 29 that construction had begun and that more than 50 miles of fence would be put up in parts of the West Bank in the next few months. Government officials have declined to give an estimate of the costs, but the first 50-mile section is unofficially put as high as $125 million.

Mr. Sharon says Israeli forces will be on both sides of the fence and will control a security zone one to three miles wide inside the West Bank. The Israeli military would also control a 5-to-10-mile "buffer zone" along the border with Jordan.

Under the proposal, no Israeli settlements and military bases on the West Bank would be dismantled, and Israeli forces would continue to control aquifers, major roads and all terrain 1,200 feet above sea level.

Support for the fence is so strong that it has altered the political landscape. Hawks who long opposed a West Bank fence out of fear that it would become a de facto border signifying Palestinian control of the West Bank now support it. So do some who hold that only a negotiated settlement will end terror attacks.

...

[cerulean]

One main problem I can see (although this is really endemic to dealing with Arab terrorists in any event) is that maintaining this wall in the face of possibly constant attacks might be a problem. All sorts of "creative" methods may be dreamed up to attack the structure and any soldiers guarding it.

The Gaza wall may work to the extent it does partially because there are so many other vulnerable spots that it isn't efficient to attack from there. When the West Bank becomes similarly guarded, I'm not sure the same reasoning will apply.

Nonetheless, given the popularity of this proposal, I hope it works out for the best.

[gregg]

Nobody expects it to be 100% effected but none the less it will reduce the attacks comming from the Palestinians and will save lives. If one life is saved by this fence I think it will be worth it.

[Mediocrates]

It worked to block off West Berlin from East Germany for 30 years. It can't be impossible.

[gregg]

Originally posted by Mediocrates
It worked to block off West Berlin from East Germany for 30 years. It can't be impossible.

Thats true, really good example.

[Gatorade]

A problem with a wall is that people can dig under it. And shoot rockets over it too but I'll stick to under it for now.

There have been a bunch of tunnels found recently under the US/Mexico border. This one was found just this week.

Tunnel Under Border May Be 20 Years Old
Investigation: Secret passage was used to transport drugs to U.S. and weapons to Mexico, officials say.

By MATEA GOLD, TIMES STAFF WRITER


A 21/2-month-long investigation of the underground passageway, discovered by American drug agents in late February, has revealed a sophisticated operation that officials believe was active for at least a decade, far longer than they originally thought. U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration officials say the tunnel was one of the most profitable smuggling avenues used by the notorious Arellano Felix drug cartel to transport drugs to the U.S. and bring weapons and money back into Mexico.

"What's scary is that here we have so much security along the border, yet they could have moved so much product without being caught," said Donald Thornhill Jr., a spokesman for the DEA's San Diego office. "It's humbling when you just consider the length of time we think this thing was being used."

This is not the first drug tunnel found burrowed under the U.S.-Mexico border, but it is one of the most elaborate. The examination of the secret corridor, which has been cemented shut, provided agents with clues to an extensive construction process that may have taken as long as two years.

Digging through the hard soil, pocked with rocks, would have been a backbreaking endeavor that required the use of jackhammers, drills and picks, at a pace of probably a foot a day, DEA officials said.

When it was completed, however, the corridor provided a near-foolproof way to transport contraband undetected. In fact, the smugglers using the corridor were so confident in its security that when DEA agents discovered the passageway on Feb. 27, acting on a tip from a previous drug seizure, they found 300 pounds of marijuana inside.

The tunnel began under a fireplace in the ranch house outside Tecate, where a hydraulic lift was used to move a steel grate in the floor, revealing a passageway below.

Investigators believe a small room below the fireplace was used as a staging area to sort and package drugs. From there, the 875-foot passageway wended its way through the earth to a barn-style house in a rural area of eastern San Diego County known as Tierra del Sol. At the end of the tunnel, a ladder led up to a floor safe hidden behind a staircase in the house. The safe and the staircase could be swung open with levers.

The designers of the operation had to know about engineering, welding and electrical wiring, officials said.

"They did a real bang-up job," Thornhill said.

The 4-by-4-foot tunnel was reinforced with planks of wood that covered the entire length of the passageway. Railroad tracks were laid along the floor to transport a battery-operated cart, which pulled two flatbed cars. A ventilation pipe ran the length of the passageway, and lightbulbs were strung from the ceiling every 50 feet.

Using the rail carts, a shipment of drugs could reach the other side of the border in minutes.

U.S. officials believe the tunnel may have existed in a rough form as long as 20 years ago, as a small "rabbit hole" used by traffickers to get drugs north without detection.

A more formal tunnel was probably constructed about 10 or 12 years ago, when the homes that covered the openings on either side were being built, Mexican and U.S. officials said.

But finding the passageways is not easy, Thornhill said.

"We can't just go onto private property and look for tunnels," he said. "We have to have a reason." http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-000035411may19.story?null

[Vic]

Originally posted by Mediocrates
It worked to block off West Berlin from East Germany for 30 years. It can't be impossible.
The wall was intended to prevent unarmed East German civilians from fleeing into West Berlin. In this respect it certainly worked.

The comparison would be valid if West Berlin had tried to carry out military attacks in East Germany, which, especially given the balance of power at that time, has never been the case. Besides, look at the map. West Berlin was 100% encircled, with several hundred km separating it from West Germany.

This illustrates the problem quite neatly. The West Bank wall would as much encircle Israel proper as the Palestinian-dominated territories. The nearest to the Berlin wall is a right-wing "enclaves" plan (was it Lieberman?): the hermetic encirclement of several tiny Palestinian territorial entities with everything between them under total Israeli control. But that wouldn't be a nice thing to do.

[Mediocrates]

not at all -

Relocate the settlers at EU expense and wall off the WB from Israel. Same with Gaza. Make it a Korea style DMZ. Surely someone will try to dig tunnels under it and fling rockets over it but nothing is a perfect fix. At any rate - no matter much it sticks in the craw of both sides there will need to be a permanent third party to monitor and control air routes between WB and Gaza. Neither party can have sole control whether it be Palistan west-east or Israel north-south. I also recommend an isolation of Israeli and Palistan ports from one another. I really believe that the only solution is to leave the WB and Gaza and turn their backs on Palistan forever.

Both parties will need highly effective missile defence systems since it is not possible to negotiate a scenario where either party does not aim their missiles at one another.

I suppose our EU brethren will call this racist zionist claptrap too - but that's going to happen anyway so why bother? It's not as if the Eurowhores won't be allowed to sell weapons to both sides.

Arm everyone for the good folk of Brussels.