Anti-Disengagement Plays Prank on Tel Aviv Residents

[Womble]

Tel Avivians get scare (http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3092932,00.html)

Locals told to evacuate homes due to subway works; “official letter” apparent anti-pullout prank
By Yuval Karni and Ofer Petersburg

TEL AVIV - Concerned residents called the Tel Aviv City Hall and the Prime Minister’s Office to complain about an “official letter” informing them they must evacuate their homes to accommodate subway construction work.

However, as it turned out the notice was apparently a prank by anti-pullout activists who wanted to give residents of central Israel a taste of what Gaza and northern West Bank would-be-evacuees are going through.

“During the government session that took place on May 23 it was decided to transfer the authority for building a subway system in Tel Aviv from the city to the Prime Minister’s Office,” the letter said.

Residents were also informed the area they reside in was found suitable for subway works, and as a result they would have to relocate around May 2006.

Mayor also got letter

Notably, the letters arrived in an official envelope bearing the Prime Minister’s Office address and official state insignia. Moreover, the notices bore the “signature” of the Prime Minister’s Office Director General Ilan Cohen, despised by radical settlers in light of his role in pullout preparations.

Tel Aviv Mayor Ron Huldai was among those who received the letter, but he immediately recognized the notice was fake.

“I regret the severe act of forging a government of Israel document on such a sensitive issue,” he said. “It’s a pity.”

The Prime Minister’s Office, meanwhile said, “we are talking about an act of deceit and forgery that hurts innocent citizens. The matter will be handled by the authorities.”






The anti-pullout crowd has really gone nuts. :mad:

[Ophra]

They went nuts a long time ago Womble.... to be precise on the evening of November 4, 1995.... when they shot a 73 year old man in the back. !!!!!

[Womble]

They went nuts a long time ago Womble.... to be precise on the evening of November 4, 1995.... when they shot a 73 year old man in the back. !!!!!
"They"? I thought it was Igal Amir. Or are you a supporter of Barry Hamish's conspiracy theories? :p

[Ophra]

"They"? I thought it was Igal Amir. Or are you a supporter of Barry Hamish's conspiracy theories? :p

Nope... I know all about Barry Chamish ... he should be certified . He also believes in UFO's you know :D

"They" as in the right-wing religious extremists, who are all part of the Settler movement . Yigal Amir did not act alone .... and he was fully supported both before and after the assassination by the religious right including Rabbis !!!

[Ophra]

Have you seen this from today's Jerusalem Post ??

: http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull&cid=1117420063979

"They" want the IBA to fire Chaim Yavin... for making a documentary about "them" ..... free speech huh ? :rolleyes:

You going to watch it Womble ?? ... it's on tonight .

I would be interested on your comments tomorrow ... if you feel strong enough on here now to be honest and say exactly what you feel :)

[Womble]

Nope... I know all about Barry Chamish ... he should be certified . He also believes in UFO's you know :D

[quote]
"They" as in the right-wing religious extremists, who are all part of the Settler movement.
Ophra, and you know that. There is no big scary settler conspiracy.



Yigal Amir did not act alone .... and he was fully supported both before and after the assassination by the religious right including Rabbis !!!
Only by the freaks outside of the right or religious mainstream. Oh and by KettleWhistle :rolleyes:

[Ophra]

[QUOTE=Ophra]Nope... I know all about Barry Chamish ... he should be certified . He also believes in UFO's you know


Ophra, and you know that. There is no big scary settler conspiracy.


Only by the freaks outside of the right or religious mainstream. Oh and by KettleWhistle


"" There is no big scary settler conspiracy.""...... oh!.. but there is Womble .

"" Only by the freaks outside of the right or religious mainstream "" .... errr .. correct me if I'm wrong ... but aint that what extremism is ?? :confused:

Excerpts from aforementioned article in today's JP Womble ;) :.....

.... "" Along the way, Yavin also listens to an Israeli soldier posted in Hebron who wonders how people can remain silent in face of the "horrors" he sees the army committing, and telling about a settler in the city pointing at a Palestinian child and asking him why he wasn't shooting it. ""

... ."" and to confront his viewers with the extremism of figures such as Noam Federman and his wife, who smiles into the camera while outlining her political philosophy: the Arabs must be given an ultimatum to leave of their own will, or hoarded onto buses and driven out as far as possible. "Otherwise," she explains, hugging her young son, "we should just bomb them and kill them." ""

....."" he speaks out loudly and clearly against the existential danger he feels the settler movement poses to Israel's moral and physical survival ""

*************

[Womble]

I have a very low opinion on the unbearably boring Channel 1 in general and on Yavin in particular. I don't expect anything good to come from that docu. There's very few people in Israel capable of making a good documentary on explosive subjects like that, and Yavin certainly isn't one of them. He is good as a news caster because he has certain charisma- but that is all he really has.

By the way, from the article:



Although "In the Land of the Settlers" ostensibly presents different points of view concerning the conflict between Israelis and Palestinians beyond the green line, objectivity is not what Yavin was aiming for. On the contrary, as he has made clear in a series of recent interviews, his purpose was to shed for once the objective mask he habitually wears on television and to express his personal views.

Israel's "Mr. Television," who over the past three decades has been identified as the voice of national consensus, seems, in many ways, to have made this series less in order to hear what the settlers and Palestinians had to say to him indeed, they say little that we haven't already heard before but in order to sound his own voice against the Israeli occupation of Gaza and the West Bank.

I don't expect to see a drop of honesty in that movie.

[Leon]

I dont see anything wrong with it. I thought it was pretty funny and witty of them to do such a thing - “During the government session that took place on May 23 it was decided to transfer the authority for building a subway system in Tel Aviv from the city to the Prime Minister’s Office,”

hehehe good on them. Its just a non-voilent/peaceful way of protesting the pull out and they still retain their sense of humor. Apart from accussing them of going nuts, what would you do in a situation where you were faced with been uprooted from your home?

[Womble]

I dont see anything wrong with it. I thought it was pretty funny and witty of them to do such a thing - “During the government session that took place on May 23 it was decided to transfer the authority for building a subway system in Tel Aviv from the city to the Prime Minister’s Office,”

hehehe good on them. Its just a non-voilent/peaceful way of protesting the pull out and they still retain their sense of humor. Apart from accussing them of going nuts, what would you do in a situation where you were faced with been uprooted from your home?
I certainly wouldn't resort to forging false documents in order to make a point. And I certainly would try my hardest to not harm other people who are not doing me any harm.

[Leon]

I certainly wouldn't resort to forging false documents in order to make a point. And I certainly would try my hardest to not harm other people who are not doing me any harm.

i dont see them harming people and its a good way to stage a protest - peaceful/non voilent with a touch of humor ;)

[Mediocrates]

They seem to be almost as thin skinned as Arabs? They are mad because they were tricked and now look foolish.

Today's threat condition color is lobster (http://www.charlestonseafood.com/images/Amazon/Lobster-500.jpg)

[wellofvow]

They went nuts a long time ago Womble.... to be precise on the evening of November 4, 1995.... when they shot a 73 year old man in the back. !!!!!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Womble
"They"? I thought it was Igal Amir. Or are you a supporter of Barry Hamish's conspiracy theories?


"They" as in the right-wing religious extremists, who are all part of the Settler movement . Yigal Amir did not act alone .... and he was fully supported both before and after the assassination by the religious right including Rabbis !!!

Whoa. I am very uncomfortable with this stuff.

It is just too close to "the Jews killed Christ".

Not all people who live in Gush Katif are right-wing, not all are religious, and not all are extremists.

"Never say never" is good to remember. "Never say all" is good too.

The know-nothing media does quite enough stereotyping of Israel, thank you very much.

[Ophra]

Not all people who live in Gush Katif are right-wing, not all are religious, and not all are extremists.

With all due respect WOV .... I never said they were .

What I said was ... "" "They" as in the right-wing religious extremists, who are all part of the Settler movement . ""....... I never said all settlers and I never said all the people that live in Gush Katif !!!

[Ophra]

Whoa. I am very uncomfortable with this stuff.

Are you comfortable with this stuff ?????????????..............

From Radio Free Israel @ http://www.radreeisrael.com/emergencynewsupdate01092004.htm

Copied and pasted because I think this might come down soon :



EXCLUSIVE EMERGENCY NEWS RELEASE FROM RADIO FREE ISRAEL

02 September 2004 - 17 Elul 5764 Jerusalem Israel Local time 11:00 A.M.

TO: Friends of Yesha, Eretz Yisrael and Am Yisrael

Radio Free Israel is commencing, immediately, to advance the only real valid alternative, proactive RECONSTRUCTION.

RFI will broadcast that presently and immediately the JEWISH Nation demand the resignation of all persons in government.

That to be followed by FREE ELECTIONS WITHOUT generals or any of the present politicians. In the interim the IBA shall be disbanded.

YET... We doubt that the sharon-peresites and their foreign controllers would oblige since EVEN AS OUR PEOPLE WERE BEING AGAIN BLOWN UP they voted onto themselves NEW Ministry's. What exists there... is a pestilence of unlimited proportions.

Failing that...RFI will then demand the LIKUD to expel the general and his entourage, and elect new caretaker representations. The caretaker representation will solely operate pending FREE ELECTIONs to follow and that, RIGIDLY without foreign moneys or generals or present day politicos. That is not likely either since the LIKUD items are just as corrupt as MAPAI was and is.

Starting September 10, RFI will then promote calls for open organized civil disobedience leading to the exile or detention into NEWLY elected courts of all the UNJews involved on Oslo and its derivatives. And then RFI and whomever else is prepared to join us in a call for FREE ELECTION of a new government system. FREE ELECTION of a Constitutional Court and the development of ALL the details included in our Platform.

RFI will then be ready to commence broadcasting in Internet. Others have means to expand services.

Referendums, stickers, human chains, posters, telephone campaigns, elections MEAN NOTHING to the trash dressed in kakhi or post khaki. And to the Peresites, even less. All of us MUST understand that the Israeli generals are not better than the degenerates in South American juntas. Or the former Vietnam Dhiem generals.

WARNING: The government takeover of the Police means that live ammunition will be used, with the intent to (Chas v'chalillah) kill the Jewish People. We must except that and not act in advance but be ready for self defense as need be! Sharon and his criminals are planning to perform transfer and murder
(G-D Forbid) as needed!

Either we, the Jewish People stand up for ourselves and scream "NEVER AGAIN" and back the screams up with our united actions, or we will be (G-D Forbid) transferred/murdered by Sharon's mercenaries or by his Peresites Islamic partners or by both.

Coupled the above acts of inhumanity with the following verified information and you can understand the predicament that the Jewish People are in and how devastiting the results to our homeland could be if we do not act immediately to stop the madness. We are driven by our laws to engage the enemy, without fear, straightfowardly, no matter who the enemy is!

We personally received the following while last in Tel Aviv at an off site location. That informants are very much in the know and they informed me that these are substantiated suspicions. FOUNDED SUSPICIONS, that the US media disclosure of the so called spy case was ordered from above, at the HIGHEST LEVEL of the US secret counter intelligence facilities.

Our informants indicate that there are founded suspicions of the entire affair it is a very deep double cross operation run against Israel by Israeli elements associated with the nemesis. I can confirm that the informants, impeccable folk, believe that all is LOST for the NEMESIS who intends to destroy ALL and the State Department is willing. I have asked ALL our people inside to chase for MORE information and facts on this. I assume as General Manager of Radio Free Israel, total responsibility for the fact that I was so informed.

The people that transmitted the infomation spoke face to face with me, are fully trustworthy, and were livid and raging at the implications of Sharon and his entourage's actions.

The nemesis is the UNJewish top level group including Peres, Sharon-(Mofaz), Mazuz, Arbel, Beinish, Beilin, Shahak, Barak, Rabin's family, GSS top echelons, etc. Embassy elements as well as certain US based Israeli industrial powers.

The information is that Sharon, secluded since his last huge loss at the Likud Central, repeatedly interfaced, with the US ambassador and CIA Station folk as well as others for whom we are still digging out names for. Peres and Lapid were at all times part of the review. Some arrived to the Ranch in US and Israeli military uniform.The purpose of the meetings was to develop tools to use as they concluded that the "disengagement" label was damaged beyond repair.

As Professor Paul Eidelberg so clearly wrote yesterday: “G-D surely makes MAD those who go against HIM, before HE brings them down”

Yes the above means open civil disobedience and demands for the ultimate removal from all State offices of the UNJews currently know as "the government" and with very high risks, but then again LOOK what is at stake and what our people have received over the past 56 years from those following their UNJewish paths.

RFI warns all that the AM YISRAEL (THE JEWISH NATION) must act, including marching on Jerusalem and setting seige to the Knesset, with full knowledge that it will be done assuming extremely high risks, and with the knowledge that all we do for ourselves and Am Yisrael is insured to succeed by Ha' Kadosh Borechu!

SHmuel Ha'levii, General Manager - Comments to: RadI1@netvision.net.il
Yrachmiel ben Menachem Mendel Elias, Editor/Webmaster - Comments to: RadI2@netvison.net.il
RADIO FREE ISRAEL - WEBSITE: Http://www.radreeisrael.com


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The information in this special news release bulletin was sent to you with one reason and one reason only in mind, “ To Activate the Jewish People and the Friends of the Jewish People, in a unified action to protect and preserve our Jewish Heritage – The Land of Israel. Please Act on it immediately.

For further contact information visit the above site, and be sure to subscribe to our further bulletins. The entire Jewish People need this information – please pass it on and when you publish it on your site, please send us notification so that we can acknowledge your participation and add your website or publication to our trusted links!

YbMM, Editor RFI

********

"" There is no big scary settler conspiracy."" ..... really Womble ?? :rolleyes:

[Mediocrates]

So you have conspiracy theory tinfoil hat wearers too? Have them come over here to Idaho and Montana. They'll have so much land their heads will explode. But they'll get along with all the wackos there.

[KettleWhistle]

Tel Avivians get scare (http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3092932,00.html)

Locals told to evacuate homes due to subway works; “official letter” apparent anti-pullout prank
By Yuval Karni and Ofer Petersburg

TEL AVIV - Concerned residents called the Tel Aviv City Hall and the Prime Minister’s Office to complain about an “official letter” informing them they must evacuate their homes to accommodate subway construction work.

However, as it turned out the notice was apparently a prank by anti-pullout activists who wanted to give residents of central Israel a taste of what Gaza and northern West Bank would-be-evacuees are going through.

Not the way? Yeah, I bet it sucks to be put in other people's shoes for once.

[Overload]

I dont see anything wrong with it. I thought it was pretty funny and witty of them to do such a thing - “During the government session that took place on May 23 it was decided to transfer the authority for building a subway system in Tel Aviv from the city to the Prime Minister’s Office,”

hehehe good on them. Its just a non-voilent/peaceful way of protesting the pull out and they still retain their sense of humor. Apart from accussing them of going nuts, what would you do in a situation where you were faced with been uprooted from your home?

Hehe, it sounds a little like the introduction to the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, if anyone read it. Basically, the main character was going to get his house demolished because the government didnt notify him about it. They then told him that the plans were for public view in the government office for weeks. Anyways, aliens then come and tell the people of earth that their planet is to be demolished for a hyperspace bypass and if they have any concerns, they should go to Alpha Centuari where the plans for construction had been on view for the last fifty years.

Hehe. Good job guys.

[Overload]

They went nuts a long time ago Womble.... to be precise on the evening of November 4, 1995.... when they shot a 73 year old man in the back. !!!!!


How old are you again?

[Ophra]

How old are you again?

I was born onto Israeli soil 4 years after the State came into existance ...... you work it out.

[Ophra]

Hehe, it sounds a little like the introduction to the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, if anyone read it. Basically, the main character was going to get his house demolished because the government didnt notify him about it. They then told him that the plans were for public view in the government office for weeks. Anyways, aliens then come and tell the people of earth that their planet is to be demolished for a hyperspace bypass and if they have any concerns, they should go to Alpha Centuari where the plans for construction had been on view for the last fifty years.

Hehe. Good job guys.

So you think this is amusing ??? ..... and you ask how old I am :rolleyes:

Please read the following from today's news.... the country is being pulled apart by this ... there is nothing funny about any of it !!!!

Respect for the traffic blockers

17-year-old Renana Mermelstein can't decide whether or not to support road blocking protesters
By Renana Marmelstein

In the middle of studying for one of my matriculation exams last week, two girls knocked on my door and introduced themselves as students from the girls yeshiva in Maaleh Levona.

They moved here this week, to study and to work.

Anyway, they asked me to sign a petition supporting the road blockers. I thought a lot about whether to sign it or not.

Would it really help anything? Obstructing traffic only makes people hate us more.

Then again, if people put themselves out this much for it, maybe there's something to it.

Then, on Shabbat I read something on Katif.net I believe everyone should read:

The kids who are shutting down your roads were supposed to knock on your doors politely, to try to convince you to vote against the disengagement plan in a national referendum; but you never gave them a chance to speak nicely, so they came to meet you here on the street.

They are good kids, believe me, I know them well. They don't drink, don't smoke, and only know violence from the movies they see once in a long while.

They don't stab each other in nightclubs on Friday nights; don't throw rocks at buses of soccer teams they don't like. And now they are sitting in jail, but not because they raised a hand at any police officer.

At the end of the day, they wanted to halt the daily flow of life. When the foreign minister of Zimbabwe comes to visit, his motorcade also blocks streets around Jerusalem.

When the Maccabi Tel Aviv basketball team wins yet another championship, the city stops.

So, too, when the country is about to uproot a whole group of its citizens from their homes, the traffic can stop for a few minutes.

Of course, it is true, in this struggle, just like on the road, that one must not be right, but wise, and it is not at all clear that blocking traffic wins us a lot of public relations points.

It is also true that it would be preferable to find more creative, and less obstructive ways to protest. But we are not having a constructive discussion over a nice cup of coffee. You are frustrated because you want to get home, and you are unable to hear my rational arguments and explanations.

At the same time, these kids have also lost their patience, and they are unable to hear your lectures and mine.

When they block your traffic, you react from the gut. But in recent months, these kids have had so much blocked that they have also lost the ability to use their heads, and have started to react from the gut.

You are angry because they blocked your traffic. They are angry because their mouths were shut (Eliashiv Reichler, Gush.net).

I think that if you were in favor of the disengagement and got stuck in traffic because of a protest, rather than get angry you would respect the protesters for being prepared to sacrifice so much for their beliefs.

I challenge you to show me one person in favor of the disengagement who'd be willing to sit even one day in jail to support his views.

So, how about a bit of respect, a bit of understanding. Take a half-hour to think. You want to give the enemy a bit of our land? People here have been fighting for their homes for a year-and-a-half already, have been living without any routine, and you're whining about a traffic jam?

So a little support for the folks here, and what we're going through. Regardless of your political views.

Afterthought: During the last demonstration, we saw how the cops function. They had trouble containing 1,000 people. What's going to happen when the eviction orders come down (God forbid)?

May we only hear good things. Teenagers, good luck on your exams.

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3093108,00.html

Now read the Talkbacks ... see what I mean ????

[Overload]

I was born onto Israeli soil 4 years after the State came into existance ...... you work it out.

And yet you act like a child.

[Ariksan]

I think this is a rather humorous prank - to draw a comparsion to the Rabin murder is just sick and shows the mindset of the current left which tries to radicalize and smear everyone that doesn't agree with them.

[Overload]

So you think this is amusing ??? ..... and you ask how old I am :rolleyes:

Please read the following from today's news.... the country is being pulled apart by this ... there is nothing funny about any of it !!!!

Respect for the traffic blockers

17-year-old Renana Mermelstein can't decide whether or not to support road blocking protesters
By Renana Marmelstein

In the middle of studying for one of my matriculation exams last week, two girls knocked on my door and introduced themselves as students from the girls yeshiva in Maaleh Levona.

They moved here this week, to study and to work.

Anyway, they asked me to sign a petition supporting the road blockers. I thought a lot about whether to sign it or not.

Would it really help anything? Obstructing traffic only makes people hate us more.

Then again, if people put themselves out this much for it, maybe there's something to it.

Then, on Shabbat I read something on Katif.net I believe everyone should read:

The kids who are shutting down your roads were supposed to knock on your doors politely, to try to convince you to vote against the disengagement plan in a national referendum; but you never gave them a chance to speak nicely, so they came to meet you here on the street.

They are good kids, believe me, I know them well. They don't drink, don't smoke, and only know violence from the movies they see once in a long while.

They don't stab each other in nightclubs on Friday nights; don't throw rocks at buses of soccer teams they don't like. And now they are sitting in jail, but not because they raised a hand at any police officer.

At the end of the day, they wanted to halt the daily flow of life. When the foreign minister of Zimbabwe comes to visit, his motorcade also blocks streets around Jerusalem.

When the Maccabi Tel Aviv basketball team wins yet another championship, the city stops.

So, too, when the country is about to uproot a whole group of its citizens from their homes, the traffic can stop for a few minutes.

Of course, it is true, in this struggle, just like on the road, that one must not be right, but wise, and it is not at all clear that blocking traffic wins us a lot of public relations points.

It is also true that it would be preferable to find more creative, and less obstructive ways to protest. But we are not having a constructive discussion over a nice cup of coffee. You are frustrated because you want to get home, and you are unable to hear my rational arguments and explanations.

At the same time, these kids have also lost their patience, and they are unable to hear your lectures and mine.

When they block your traffic, you react from the gut. But in recent months, these kids have had so much blocked that they have also lost the ability to use their heads, and have started to react from the gut.

You are angry because they blocked your traffic. They are angry because their mouths were shut (Eliashiv Reichler, Gush.net).

I think that if you were in favor of the disengagement and got stuck in traffic because of a protest, rather than get angry you would respect the protesters for being prepared to sacrifice so much for their beliefs.

I challenge you to show me one person in favor of the disengagement who'd be willing to sit even one day in jail to support his views.

So, how about a bit of respect, a bit of understanding. Take a half-hour to think. You want to give the enemy a bit of our land? People here have been fighting for their homes for a year-and-a-half already, have been living without any routine, and you're whining about a traffic jam?

So a little support for the folks here, and what we're going through. Regardless of your political views.

Afterthought: During the last demonstration, we saw how the cops function. They had trouble containing 1,000 people. What's going to happen when the eviction orders come down (God forbid)?

May we only hear good things. Teenagers, good luck on your exams.

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3093108,00.html

Now read the Talkbacks ... see what I mean ????


I read that three people wrote three lines about something or other. Why don t you articulate your views on the subject. I've never actually seen you discuss anything, just posting articles or labeling people out of some paranoid delusion. You have problem with civil disobedience apparently when it comes from one sector of society. These people are about to lose their homes because Sharon is too spineless to fight terror. No one seems to be listening to them, and they are then ones who are about to sacrifice their livelihood so you can safely sit on your couch and watch Arabs cheer on the ruins of rich communities who provided half the citrus exports for Israel. I've seen what happened to people after Yamit. Half of them couldnt restart, some are in mental institutions or committed suicide.

The people in Gush Katif are self sufficient. All of them have children in the IDF protecting their own communities. They arent touching anyone, but the government they helped elect because of a promise by Sharon who said that there was no difference between Gush Katif and Tel Aviv, has turned their backs on them. If they wanted disengagement they could have voted for Mitzna who ran on that platform. But they didnt, and neither did most of the nation. Now they feel disenfranchised, betrayed and frustrated that they are on the chopping block because Sharon suddenly developed an Israeli Savior complex. They have every right to protest and do everything short of violence to show their disaproval. Thats democracy.

And if you respond by posting another article, I'll retract my statement that you act like a child, and come to believe that you are a child posing as an old grandmother for some sick reason. Lets see the wisdom of age, I want to hear your own words. If you dont sound like a 12 year old, as you do whenever I read what you write, I just might respect your opinion. If not I dont want to waste my time.

[Ophra]

And yet you act like a child.

How so ??

[Ophra]

I think this is a rather humorous prank - to draw a comparsion to the Rabin murder is just sick and shows the mindset of the current left which tries to radicalize and smear everyone that doesn't agree with them.

Once again... yet again... I am not a leftist !!!

[Ophra]

I read that three people wrote three lines about something or other. Why don t you articulate your views on the subject. I've never actually seen you discuss anything, just posting articles or labeling people out of some paranoid delusion. You have problem with civil disobedience apparently when it comes from one sector of society. These people are about to lose their homes because Sharon is too spineless to fight terror. No one seems to be listening to them, and they are then ones who are about to sacrifice their livelihood so you can safely sit on your couch and watch Arabs cheer on the ruins of rich communities who provided half the citrus exports for Israel. I've seen what happened to people after Yamit. Half of them couldnt restart, some are in mental institutions or committed suicide.

The people in Gush Katif are self sufficient. All of them have children in the IDF protecting their own communities. They arent touching anyone, but the government they helped elect because of a promise by Sharon who said that there was no difference between Gush Katif and Tel Aviv, has turned their backs on them. If they wanted disengagement they could have voted for Mitzna who ran on that platform. But they didnt, and neither did most of the nation. Now they feel disenfranchised, betrayed and frustrated that they are on the chopping block because Sharon suddenly developed an Israeli Savior complex. They have every right to protest and do everything short of violence to show their disaproval. Thats democracy.

And if you respond by posting another article, I'll retract my statement that you act like a child, and come to believe that you are a child posing as an old grandmother for some sick reason. Lets see the wisdom of age, I want to hear your own words. If you dont sound like a 12 year old, as you do whenever I read what you write, I just might respect your opinion. If not I dont want to waste my time.

How old are you ????????????????????????????????????

[Overload]

How so ??

Ophra, I suggest that you read some of the comments you have made over the years. They sound childish. Insulting people for spelling mistakes, stereotyping an entire population, boasting about the superiority of your family and your language skills, responding to insults or initiating insults in kind. It is not something I expect from a wise old woman who has lived through 7 wars and has children in the IDF. It is something I expect from an adolescent who wants to boast to complete strangers. Not only that, but you utterly fail to express your opinion in a manner befitting a person who claims such an estounding education. Three languages, one's own business, and yet I have yet to hear an educated opinion from you about subjects you seem to care about. I want to know your views, I want to discuss them in an intelligent manner, because I feel that if you are who you say you are then, you have views I can learn from. But it is becoming painfully clear that is not the case. Most of your posts are articles from other people, other posts are three sentence lines filled with things one would hear at a political rally as one person shouts across to another in an effort to insult them or demean them. This is a discussion forum. People can read and digest your writings, and people can judge you based on what you write. I read the little original material that you provided, and so far, I judge you to be acting like a child. I eagerly await being proved wrong in the future.

[Overload]

Once again... yet again... I am not a leftist !!!

Then articulate your views.

[Ophra]

Then articulate your views.

Nope son ... sorry . I have nothing to say to a racist... I would just be wasting my breathe... and I'm too dern busy right now to bother with the likes of you.

[Overload]

Nope son ... sorry . I have nothing to say to a racist... I would just be wasting my breathe... and I'm too dern busy right now to bother with the likes of you.

Then there we are. Well, at least now I know that I am talking to a child. I guess I wont be proven wrong after all.

But I'll bite anyways. Was Ben Gurion and Weizmann "racists" for supporting transfer?

[Mediocrates]

Yeah yeah so you all hate each other. Ok.


So what I'm taking away from this is that there is practically no legitimate protest about much of anything in Israel unless you want to be branded a terrorist or someone threatening civil war. Violent or non violent apparently no difference. Unless of course it's a strike called by the loyal opposition. If I have it right Oprah let me know, thanks.

I don't know whether it's irony or history but for all the pro disengagement zealots who's cause celebe is that they want to drag their own country into what they view is the modern age - - well what are you complaining about? You're there. Civil disobediance and vitriolic differences of belief and opinion are part and parcel with that. What do these people think that being a post Zionist country consists of? Honestly these people are starting to sound as delusional as the Palestinians and the Communists: anything less than instant perfect imaginary paradise is unacceptable.
So you toss all your Gazans to the curb, you lock up people in administrative detention, you drive them from their homes and criminalize speaking out against it. And you thought this would lead........where, exactly? It seems that social discourse settled in the streets, protesting is exactly where you wanted to be; just like every other western facing country. What do think the texture of public discourse is?

[minusthejihad]

I just read 2 or 3 posts from Overload trying to get Ophra to debate a subject. She answers by calling him a "racist" and ends it there. Here is the first interested debator to challenge her in something other than a flame war and she stops the conversation with the ultimate "Why do you beat your wife?" comment. So it leaves me to wonder, why the hell is she here in the first place? Obviously it is not to debate because she had her chance and called the guy a "racist" (for what, I still don't know).

She may not be a kid, but her last exchange was the epitomy of immaturity.

Overload :1 Ophra : -1

[KettleWhistle]

The more I read Ophra's material, the more I suspect that "she" is just some bored kid from Lahore getting his kicks.

[Overload]

Yeah yeah so you all hate each other. Ok.




Actually, no. I dont particulary have an opinion one way or the other. Although I do have a suspicion that "she" is a troll. She definatelly fits the classic definition of one.

[Leon]

I read that three people wrote three lines about something or other. Why don t you articulate your views on the subject. I've never actually seen you discuss anything, just posting articles or labeling people out of some paranoid delusion. You have problem with civil disobedience apparently when it comes from one sector of society. These people are about to lose their homes because Sharon is too spineless to fight terror. No one seems to be listening to them, and they are then ones who are about to sacrifice their livelihood so you can safely sit on your couch and watch Arabs cheer on the ruins of rich communities who provided half the citrus exports for Israel. I've seen what happened to people after Yamit. Half of them couldnt restart, some are in mental institutions or committed suicide.

The people in Gush Katif are self sufficient. All of them have children in the IDF protecting their own communities. They arent touching anyone, but the government they helped elect because of a promise by Sharon who said that there was no difference between Gush Katif and Tel Aviv, has turned their backs on them. If they wanted disengagement they could have voted for Mitzna who ran on that platform. But they didnt, and neither did most of the nation. Now they feel disenfranchised, betrayed and frustrated that they are on the chopping block because Sharon suddenly developed an Israeli Savior complex. They have every right to protest and do everything short of violence to show their disaproval. Thats democracy.

And if you respond by posting another article, I'll retract my statement that you act like a child, and come to believe that you are a child posing as an old grandmother for some sick reason. Lets see the wisdom of age, I want to hear your own words. If you dont sound like a 12 year old, as you do whenever I read what you write, I just might respect your opinion. If not I dont want to waste my time.

wow, way to go man. You've realised what I realised not long ago when I tried to engage in a "debate" this person (of questionable age and IQ). Dont waste any more of ure time.