Comparing Zionism to Islamism in the Guardian

[Mil]

Posted by Parsi:

The Islamic mafia is already shaping in the UK. More and more Muslims are penetrating government offices (prisons are good examples) and and educational institutes. You can get away with Jewish conspiracies and cursing Israel in Britain, but say something about Islam and you'll get your ar* kicked.

A friend of mine works for a bank here and he told me that his boss had banned commenting on Islam (positive or negative) at workplace or with customers.


It is all so very disappointing. They make Hugo and Fidel the primary defenders of human rights, scream and yell that Sudan is of interest only because of the oil, all evils in ME come from a small nation of Israel, bitterly complain that capitalists make their "miserable" Western lives overly horrible, and that all Mericans and are both stupid and fat.

It's pure nationalism and racism - nothing else. Dude, I am not sure where England and Europe in general is going. I am not sure they know what "Liberalism" actually is and freely confuse it with nationalism and racism.

There is one author on their blog who is some sort of member of Islamic Association of Britain and comments there often. Anyways, one of his articles was on the end on boycott of his organization to the British Holocaust remembrance day. I am not really sure how long you need to make a statement on such a matter. Anyways, the article was very convoluted going into some sort of diatribe about Islamic values, historic responsibilities and such and then tying it all to the Israeli/Pal conflict, Iraq and neocons. This is simply IDIOTIC!!!!! Are those people on druggies or simply stupid? And why does Guardian even allow such calibre people to post on that paper? What the f***ck is going on? What the f***ck is wrong with Britain?

[andak01]

You probably got caught by a bot scan for using the word in red above. If you really want to be on that blog, I'd explain that to the mod and say that it was used in an ironic, rather than a derogatory sense.

No, I believe somebody officially complained.

What proof do you have for this? I'd want to know if it was me. I've had a lot of differences with posters on this blog as you know. Sometimes, on a second reading, I find out the post means something different from what I originally thought. Even a human reader scanning a bunch of posts and coming across Yid and Zionist might jump to the conclusion that the author was a flagrant anti-semite and knee-jerk ban that poster.

I'd try one more email to the mod to make sure. Then you can come back and dance around and explode with joy that you've shown what *sses the Guardian mods are.

Whatever - that paper has on overwhelming interest in Jews as if Jews are planning to take over England or something. Is there absolutely nothing interesting happening on the Isles other then grievances as 300,000 large community? I am not sure.

Recognize that even if we accept that without question, that may have nothing to do with why you were banned. Even if the mod is a jerk, he or she will probably deen to tell you why you were banned if asked.

[Mil]

by Andak01:


What proof do you have for this? I'd want to know if it was me. I've had a lot of differences with posters on this blog as you know.

If they don't like your post they delete a particular post but they don't ban. In this case they removed my posting rights. In fact they even deleted all of my posts from all the boards!

It was on some blog about peace-keepers in the Congo by Mr. Tisdall.


Sometimes, on a second reading, I find out the post means something different from what I originally thought. Even a human reader scanning a bunch of posts and coming across Yid and Zionist might jump to the conclusion that the author was a flagrant anti-semite and knee-jerk ban that poster.

Well, the Zionist-Nazi thing they use quite often; as you know. Some dude even threatened me with another Holocaust to which I asked the infamous Birchamans to have the dude banned.... to which Birchamans replied that it should be my duty since as far as he was concerned only I found this offensive. Weird - for the infamous "Liberals" on that particular place.

I'd try one more email to the mod to make sure. Then you can come back and dance around and explode with joy that you've shown what *sses the Guardian mods are.

I did respond to the something of the sort but nobody responded. So I don't know.

Recognize that even if we accept that without question, that may have nothing to do with why you were banned.

I am not sure why I was banned but sure it was not for that. This was just my personal comment of the Guardian - they have some sort of fascination with Jews. I am thinking that in Britain they are afraid of some sort of Jewish revolution or something....


Even if the mod is a jerk, he or she will probably deen to tell you why you were banned if asked.

They haven't replied as to why I was banned.

[Aysun]

The people of Iran are thankful to Khomeini for three things:

1. He showed us the REAL nature Islam. Before him, and despite the 1400 years of Islamic virus in Iran, we used to think Islam was as good as any other religion.

2. He showed us the true nature of the Mullas. We used to think there could never kill other human beings.

3. He helped us see the real face the so-called "Moderate" and "educated" Muslims.
.

we are Turks, not Iranians. it was Iranians stupidity to accept those mullas. those mullas have nothing to do with Islam. their beliefs are totally cover up for their dictatorship. we can easily see the distinction between a true muslim and cover up muslim like them. if you can't see that then this is your problem.

regarding Turkey, yes Islamists are in power right now. but we Turks are not like Iranians. if you push us to the edge then you will see how we will explode and eliminate those idiot fundementalists. again if those disgusting mullas are still in power in Iran then Islam is not the one to blame here, it is the stupidity of Iranians.

[Mil]

I agree. Hey, Ataturk really beat religion out of you guys.

[Parsi]

we are Turks, not Iranians. it was Iranians stupidity to accept those mullas. those mullas have nothing to do with Islam. their beliefs are totally cover up for their dictatorship. we can easily see the distinction between a true muslim and cover up muslim like them. if you can't see that then this is your problem.

regarding Turkey, yes Islamists are in power right now. but we Turks are not like Iranians. if you push us to the edge then you will see how we will explode and eliminate those idiot fundementalists. again if those disgusting mullas are still in power in Iran then Islam is not the one to blame here, it is the stupidity of Iranians.

The question of how different nations perceive Islam or react to it is a subject for another debate and good for Turks if they're not like Iranians with respect to Mullas.

The level of education about Islam, excluding Muslims, in today's world is so high that people can easily see the compatibility of the Mullas/Islamists' ideologies with those of Mohammad and the Koran.

The Muslim hostility towards Jews, for example, is deeply routed in Islam and Mohammad's doings rather than a "misinterpretation" by the Jihadists.

[savvy]

It is all so very disappointing. They make Hugo and Fidel the primary defenders of human rights, scream and yell that Sudan is of interest only because of the oil, all evils in ME come from a small nation of Israel, bitterly complain that capitalists make their "miserable" Western lives overly horrible, and that all Mericans and are both stupid and fat.

It's pure nationalism and racism - nothing else. Dude, I am not sure where England and Europe in general is going. I am not sure they know what "Liberalism" actually is and freely confuse it with nationalism and racism.

There is one author on their blog who is some sort of member of Islamic Association of Britain and comments there often. Anyways, one of his articles was on the end on boycott of his organization to the British Holocaust remembrance day. I am not really sure how long you need to make a statement on such a matter. Anyways, the article was very convoluted going into some sort of diatribe about Islamic values, historic responsibilities and such and then tying it all to the Israeli/Pal conflict, Iraq and neocons. This is simply IDIOTIC!!!!! Are those people on druggies or simply stupid? And why does Guardian even allow such calibre people to post on that paper? What the f***ck is going on? What the f***ck is wrong with Britain?
__________________

Mil here in Canada, I have come across Muslims and Liberals trying to convince me how Jews cause terrorism etc. When I give them facts, they freak out and start calling me a neo-con Fundamentalist. I am not a neo-con or a fundamentalist so where do I fit in now?

[Mil]

Whatever - the world is insane.

[Parsi]

Mil here in Canada, I have come across Muslims and Liberals trying to convince me how Jews cause terrorism etc. When I give them facts, they freak out and start calling me a neo-con Fundamentalist. I am not a neo-con or a fundamentalist so where do I fit in now?

Neocon and fundamentalist are not necessarily the extremes of the same scale. You have been simply subject to ad hominem fallacy i.e. rather than trying to respond to your argument those people attacked your character. This is a typical tactic by most politician and Muslims (as far as this thread goes).

As far as the Islamists are concerned protecting and promoting Islam is much more important than the truth.

The so-called liberals prefer to be politically correct and have the support of the loud crowd (Muslims). The truth and facts doesn't mean much to them as long as they get their cuddle.

[Aysun]

The Muslim hostility towards Jews, for example, is deeply routed in Islam and Mohammad's doings rather than a "misinterpretation" by the Jihadists.

oh yeah, how about Christian hostility towards Jews carried on for hundreds of years??? I didn't know that Nazis were muslims(!)

how about muslim Turks never hated Jews for all those hundreds of years but lived together with them side by side? give me a break will you.

[Aysun]

I agree. Hey, Ataturk really beat religion out of you guys.

this is what fundementalists claim but it is totally untrue. Ataturk had seen that religion has nothing to do with the politics and must be separated from it. the bad thing is not the religion but the human beings. they were using the religion for their own purposes. that's why he changed the system into a secular one. it was a very difficult change though for a country which had been ruled by a religious monarchy for hundreds of years. Besides, last caliphate was also held by the Turkish Sultan so by changing the regime Ataturk also abolished this rank. and that's why today fundementalists secretly (and some openly) hate Ataturk.

[Mil]

Basically Ataturk beat religion out of society.

[Mil]

Posted by Aysun:

oh yeah, how about Christian hostility towards Jews carried on for hundreds of years??? I didn't know that Nazis were muslims(!)

how about muslim Turks never hated Jews for all those hundreds of years but lived together with them side by side? give me a break will you.

It's called nationalism. And nationalism mixed with religious idiocies in third-world societies is easily converted to hatred. That's what happened in Europe then and is what is happening in ME now.

[Parsi]

oh yeah, how about Christian hostility towards Jews carried on for hundreds of years??? I didn't know that Nazis were muslims(!)

how about muslim Turks never hated Jews for all those hundreds of years but lived together with them side by side? give me a break will you.

The pattern is the Muslim way of making up excuses for Islam and Mohammad is amazing. I'm yet to see a Muslim who can reason logically about their faith. OK then, just out of courtesy, I'll do this again.

Your argument is based on fallacies on sophistries:

1- Fallacy of two wrongs make a right. This is like you catch a murderer and question they act and they say "what about other's who've also killed". At least you're honest and didn't say "it never happened". Great the Christians and Naziz killed Jews and therefore Muslims were not alone in this and they shouldn't be criticised. Thanks for your honesty again.

2- Fallacy of faulty comparison
Comparing Christians (and not Christianity) with Islam and Mohammad is not logical. I'm questioning Islam itself and Mohammad its prophet not Muslims and Christians. Where did Jesus order killing of Jews?

Comparing Islam with Nazism (despite the similarities) actually works against you. You've brought the level your religion and it's prophet (what I'm arguing) down to those of a political party and Hitler.

3- Fallacy of focusing on biased sample
The claim "muslim Turks never hated Jews..." doesn't address the argument in question nor does it cover up the teachings of Koran and acts of Mohammad.

Again, I never said "All Muslims are hostile to Jews".

Since this is your level of reasoning and I expect you'll be using the same Islamist tactic of run-and-exhaust (avoiding the question and make the other party waste time and energy), I'll sure give a very very long break :-)

[MGB8]

this is what fundementalists claim but it is totally untrue. Ataturk had seen that religion has nothing to do with the politics and must be separated from it. the bad thing is not the religion but the human beings. they were using the religion for their own purposes. that's why he changed the system into a secular one. it was a very difficult change though for a country which had been ruled by a religious monarchy for hundreds of years. Besides, last caliphate was also held by the Turkish Sultan so by changing the regime Ataturk also abolished this rank. and that's why today fundementalists secretly (and some openly) hate Ataturk.

Aysun,

It's true. Turkey especially treated its Jewish population well. That's why you still have Jews, as opposed to most Arab nations. And Ataturk did separate religion from politics in part because of abuses (only in part). But what others here are arguing is that they believe that Islam requires the religion and state to be merged, and the Islamists and Jihadis agree. But, what I think you need to remind them of is, regardless of what this or that verse say, it is up to the Islamic world to decide how those are interpreted and what they mean.