Holocaust Denials by the Followers of Islam

[Leon Uris]

I had mentioned in some earlier posts that denial of the Holocaust is a practice that is at least wide-spread, if not complete in the Islamic world.

When I made the above comments, certain terror-condoning anti-semitic "intellectuals"/bigots immediately disputed me saying that no such practice exists in Islamic lands. Since then I have been trying to dig up some article and was finally successful today.

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satelli...=1029920579169

Arab League to participate in Holocaust denial symposium


The Arab League is to participate in a symposium opening Wednesday in Abu Dhabi that organizers say will expose Israeli "lies and exaggerations about the Holocaust ," the English-language dailies Gulf News and Khaleej Times reported Monday.

[L@mplighterM]

I don’t even have to read the article it’s a well known fact that the Arab/Muslim countries are holocaust deniers.

[Blodhemn]

if they are denying the holocaust, then why are they comparing israel to the nazi's?

[Mediocrates]

Originally posted by Blodhemn
if they are denying the holocaust, then why are they comparing israel to the nazi's?

oooops, you weren't supposed to notice that.

[NewsGuy]

Originally posted by Leon Uris
...Arab League to participate in Holocaust denial symposium

That really demonstrates that the Arab hatred of Israelis goes far beyond a simple land dispute. There is an enormous amount of anti-Semitism and other bigotry in Arab society and in their governments.

This official racism also demonstrates the huge distance between Arab countries and Western civilization. It explains in part why the current Arab regimes are no less than enemies of the West and why they should be treated as such.

[peacelover]

I think what is needed is a secularisation of the Muslim states. It doesn't mean they cannot be Muslim - Israel is jewish, but is not run strictly by Jewish law.
Likewise, the Muslim states can be run loosely on Muslim principles, and have a majority of practising Muslims (if they so choose) but we cannot have a situation where women are being stoend to death 'in the name of Allah' and where populations are being taught to hate jews and that the Holocaust, one of the biggest tragedies in modern history, did not happen

If the people in these Muslim countries want to live under Sharia, then fair enough - but in that case, where's the problem in having a democracy and letting them vote for such parties?

Furthermore, what about the non-Muslims living under Sharia?Whatever happens, people need to be free. I want the secularisation of all states not only for the good of the world, but also for the good of those living within them.

[martinw718]

Originally posted by peacelover
I think what is needed is a secularisation of the Muslim states. It doesn't mean they cannot be Muslim - Israel is jewish, but is not run strictly by Jewish law.
Likewise, the Muslim states can be run loosely on Muslim principles, and have a majority of practising Muslims (if they so choose) but we cannot have a situation where women are being stoend to death 'in the name of Allah' and where populations are being taught to hate jews and that the Holocaust, one of the biggest tragedies in modern history, did not happen

If the people in these Muslim countries want to live under Sharia, then fair enough - but in that case, where's the problem in having a democracy and letting them vote for such parties?

Furthermore, what about the non-Muslims living under Sharia?Whatever happens, people need to be free. I want the secularisation of all states not only for the good of the world, but also for the good of those living within them.

I'm trying not to agree with you but I have to on this one.

The freedom to believe or not is fundamental. (Not "fundamentalist!")

But I'm wondering what you think of this observation:

I was raised a Southern Baptist and the traditional form of that faith is far different from what is now called "fundamentalist."

In fact "fundamentalism" contains some very new elements. For example, a break with the age-old and once very sacred Baptist tradition of the priesthood of the believer with a move toward a more centralized and standardized authority. And there is a political ideology that was never a part of the Baptist tradition.

So, I have to wonder if the situation is not similar with Islamic Fundamentalism. Is it really a traditional form of Islam or is it a new thing with elements of traditional Islam perverted into something new and added in with some totally new elements?

I mean, think of the Ottoman Empire. What did it have in common with modern Islamic Fundamentalism? Not much, probably.

What do you think?

[Iori Yagami]

Originally posted by Blodhemn
if they are denying the holocaust, then why are they comparing israel to the nazi's?

Damn, that`s a great point.

[peacelover]

Martin:

I don't really know - I suspect that Islam has changed somewhat in its history. Several variations exist today I believe, although they are not as marked as Christianity. Perhaps Islam has and will continue to evolve like Christianity has...

but here's the deal - if some Muslims become less extreme and bloodthirsty, will the "fundamentalists" wage war on them as infidels as well?

[cerulean]

Originally posted by peacelover
but here's the deal - if some Muslims become less extreme and bloodthirsty, will the "fundamentalists" wage war on them as infidels as well?

It already happens every day when dissidents are killed. For that matter, many simple everyday expressions of personal freedom by Muslims are impossible - from choosing a mate to choosing reading material. Practically every country in the world with a Muslim population is under constant pressure by fundamentalists to make the rules stricter.

A couple of examples from Malaysia and Indonesia. Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Algeria, and many other countries are experiencing more extreme pressure than these two countries.

http://www.feer.com/articles/2002/02...012region.html
August 29, 2002
Model Muslim Leader?: How Malaysia's Next PM Plans To Tackle The Extremist Threat - Leader-in-waiting Abdullah Badawi, slated to become the next Malaysian prime minister next year, has burst out with a whole new image: confident, assertive and ready to tackle the big challenges, from Islamic extremism to the scourge of cronyism . . .

Unfortunately only the beginning of the following article is available online (as shown below), but I read it yesterday and it states that many moderate Muslims in Indonesia want to impose sharia. The argument of the author is that this is a good thing, which I find highly doubtful.
1. ISLAM AND SOCIETY -- August 22, 2002
The Case for Islamic Law : It's not only extremists who admire Islamic law. In Indonesia, a surprising number of moderate Muslims, worried about a collapse of moral values, would like to see a bigger ...

[RonE]

Islam as practiced today stands where Christianity stood during the Middle Ages. If there is going to be any progress whatsoever in the Arab world, both internally in the respective countries as well as their foreign policies, there needs to be a complete overhaul of Islam, or to be more precise a complete overhaul in the way Islam is INTERPRETED and enforced by the ruling theocrats.

I find it extremely ironic that during the Middle Ages Christianity was so backward in it's perception of the world while in Arabia intellectual culture was flourishing- many great scientific, medical and mathematical achievements can be attributed to that era in the Arab world. And today, in the 21st century when it was percieved that there would be a thriving human colony living on Mars in many Arab countries people get burned alive for committing adultery and have limbs amputated for petty crimes such as stealing a loaf of bread. Amazing...

[Vic]

Originally posted by cerulean
It already happens every day when dissidents are killed. For that matter, many simple everyday expressions of personal freedom by Muslims are impossible - from choosing a mate to choosing reading material. Practically every country in the world with a Muslim population is under constant pressure by fundamentalists to make the rules stricter.

... plus Afghanistan (try this query), Turkey, the fmr. Soviet Central Asia, and, oh, the territories under Palestinian control, not to mention some of the Muslim immigrant communities in Europe, whose members are constantly vying for police protection from their "brethren"...

[L@mplighterM]

Originally posted by Blodhemn
if they are denying the holocaust, then why are they comparing israel to the nazi's?

They want their cake and eat it too.

[Mediocrates]

What shades of grey we've come to. We call them moderate if they only claim the Holocaust never happened but don't actually call for the deaths of all Jews everywhere. The moderates limit themselves as in the recent 'summit' to calling all Jews everywhere merely the enemy and denying the existence of antisemitism.

Yeah that's real moderate. Other than that Mrs. Kennedy, how was the motorcade?