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http://zombietime.com/gaza_war_protest
I am not worried about Hamas -- I know that they are like slices of bread headed for the toaster.
No, what concerns me are the Jews who have no idea what they are doing.
And the website's commentator, apparently he has never read Leviticus.
My wife and I have been married coming up to 30 years. And in her family are a gay and several cultists.
God wasn't kidding -- he wrote Leviticus for good reason!
deut_20-21
Thank you for posting this. One picture is worth a thousand words and your pictures certainly sum up the the folly of the deluded ones ....
Idealism increases in direct proportion to one's distance from the problem.
Author: John Galsworthy 1867-1933, British Novelist, Playwright
Assuming that those protestors represent all gay and lesbian Americans is akin to assuming that the Neturei Karta represent all Jews. Moreover, it seems a bit disingenuous for Christians to harp on Levitical law, when Christians claim that they are no longer obliged to obey the law.
These photos have been posted before, and it seems as though they are used to entrench homophobia, more than they are to show disdain for the messages that they support. Where's the so-called "Christian love" that I'm always hearing about when people try to convert me?
Just my two cents.
Exactly what I was thinking.Originally Posted by Mosche
Deut 20-21: I assume you've taken it onto yourself to stone to death "The Gay" in your wife's family, seeing as it's in Leviticus? No? Why not? And do you equally berate eaters of bacon and shellfish, which is also forbidden in The Torah? Why do you skip some laws in Leviticus but not others?
Furthermore, despite what you claim, G-d did not write Leviticus. The Torah may be "from heaven" but that's not quite the same as anthropomorphising G-d into actually writing the Bible, is it.
The link you posted was informative, but the religious fanatical slant you add to it detracts from the valid point being made, which is a shame.
Of course you are not worried about Hamas. You supposedly live in boston, far from the Hamas beasts.
If you were a member of the Hatuel family, you would be more worried about Hamas.
Expectant mother and 4 young daughters shot to death by Islamo facists - Arabs celebrate and call killings "heroic"
http://www.militantislammonitor.org/article/id/72
May 3, 2004 -- JERUSALEM - Palestinian fiends mercilessly gunned down a pregnant Jewish settler and her four terrified little girls in their station wagon yesterday as the family headed to protest Israel's planned Gaza Strip pullout.
After riddling the car with gunfire on a road leading to Israel, the two terrorists then ran up to the vehicle and coldbloodedly pumped bullets into each of their victims' heads to make sure they had finished the job, Israeli police said.
One of the gunmen also shot the swollen belly of the eight-months-pregnant mom at point-blank range.
"At first, we thought we could do something to save the mother, but it was too late," one distraught Israeli settler said.
"The children were already dead, with bullets in the head. Little children. I don't know, I really don't know," the man said.
Killed were Tali Hatuel, 34, and her four daughters: Meirav, 2, Roni, 7, Hadar, 9, and Hila, 11.
Rescuers found the dead baby still strapped in her car seat, just above a blood-soaked children's book that had fallen on the floor.
The brutal attack occurred at around 1 p.m., as Hatuel, a social worker who counseled the relatives of terror victims, was driving her daughters from their settlement of Gush Katif to hand out fliers at a nearby protest over the planned dismantlement of their settlement and about 20 others.
A bumper sticker on their car defiantly read, "From here, we will not move."
Were the Hatuels also like slices of bread for your toaster, or is this a real world, and was the Hatuel family a real family, and are the murdering Islamic terrorist thugs barbaric beasts and not just a slice of bread for your mythical toaster!
Why of course!
No, although don't think that hasn't crossed my mind a few times. I once arrived late to a family gathering and he'd had too much to drink, and -- at the time I had resolved to try and get along with him.
Well, at that dinner, one of the couples talked about their recent trip to Europe and I suppose this fellow felt jealous (they had obliquely mentioned that some days they just stayed in their hotel room.)
So, this person mentioned that he had gone to a neighboring state and paid a woman (I don't want to call her a Mother,) money to allow him to go into her son's bedroom.
Now, he didn't say how old the son was -- he might have been 18! I don't know. But Aviva, my God is the God of the Bible and he gave us the counsel in Leviticus for good reason, and we ignore God's advice at our peril.
Do you imagine that the God of Abraham couldn't get a scribe to accurately write down what he intended? Is that your position? Or maybe you think that he's changed his mind? That's even more indefensible.
One last thing about that family incident, I called the police the next day to give them a head's up as to what this fellow confessed to. Basically they said such things happen.
And you should know something else, and this remark isn't just for Aviva, it's for all of us (me included.)
My wife and I are reading Habakkuk now, it says something very interesting... Habakkuk is told by God that he's going to turn Israel over to the Babylonians.
H. is amazed because, (he responds,) no matter how evil the Jews are, the Babylonians are much worse, and H. decries allowing such bad people to be the instruments of correction wrt the Jews.
And God explains to H. that he is using the Babylonians precisely because of who they are (read this yourself -- I may have slightly abridged the matter.) But God makes the point that it's the imperfections of the Babylonians that God intends to make use of to chastise the Jews.
So here we are today, and Israel must deal with the Iranian's, and the US is in the early stages of a complete financial collapse (morally?, it's much further along.)
I mention this because I was reminded by Habakkuk that we live in circumstances engineered for us. -- And yes I recognize that this view is extreme (in the opinion of most here,) but that's why we interact.
I warn you!!, that although God has promised that Israel will never fail, that the country will now stand forever, that doesn't mean that (so to speak, they'll be Coca-Cola in the water fountains.)
I regard the Muslims as pieces of sliced bread, all lined up waiting to become toast. These people are not the problem (of course they are the problem but when Israel decides they've had enough, they can be dealt with easily enough. Just don't wait too long -- and 'now' is too long, they should have been made into toast more than a year ago. Two years ago!)
No, the problem Israel faces is not terrorism. It's faith. And loving God.
Example: I mentioned four passages by four Jewish Patriarchs that describe the Messiah and no one wants to talk about them. Doesn't anyone think it wierd that God plugs this into his own Scriptures? Or, are we back to -- well, he didn't write them exactly?
Folks, if you think I got this wrong, why -- don't be polite, tell me. And why don't you? Because rejecting the Messiah is something that Jewish people have taken on as a cultural imperative.
I have two more things to say.
I have learned a few things. One, God can take care of someone without regard for their external circumstances. They may have a storm all around them, a dozen policemen may be breaking down the door -- with no warrant or probable cause, but people who trust in the God of the Bible stand forever, and in this world that means that they are protected and sustained.
So whether you live in Israel or the United States (or even, gasp!, Europe,) start reading what Moses wrote. Read Psalms. Read some of Isaiah. And then read the rest. Oh yes, read Habakkuk!
And two:
I should have taken this advice (that I am about to give,) myself BEFORE I did. Unfortunately for me, it was only a year or so later that I actually did.
Read the first 30 or 40 Psalms. Just sit down and read them. When I did something stood out, very exceptionally.
David wrote most of these when he was on the lam from King Saul. And not every single Psalm but most talk about God's protection, how, even in times of real trouble and peril, when everyone is against you, when most people are afraid to be seen with you, even then, for the righteous God is able to protect 'you' (such people.)
He wrote this because (obviously!,) he was in just such circumstances and he was wise enough to see that the God of Abraham was watching out for him.
And was sufficient for him.
This is exactly who God wants to be to each and every Jew, but folks, give our God a little help by reading what he wrote.
How about we allow people to make their own choices rather than judge them.
What are you talking about? Tradition says that person was Moses.Do you imagine that the God of Abraham couldn't get a scribe to accurately write down what he intended?
No. I'm saying that once the written and oral Torahs was given to the Jews, it was up to them to interpret them through the ages. If it says we should stone gays, adulterers or rebellious sons, then should that still happen in the modern world? No. Why? Because it's immoral and Judaism is not an immoral religion.Is that your position? Or maybe you think that he's changed his mind? That's even more indefensible.
Maybe no one can understand what you're talking about because most of it is so irrelevent. I gave you this link as a response to Christian claims that Jesus is the Messiah: http://www.messiahtruth.com/response.htmlExample: I mentioned four passages by four Jewish Patriarchs that describe the Messiah and no one wants to talk about them.
I assume you're not interesting in looking at it as you're not interested in informed debate, just pontificating at Jews.
YOU CAN'T MISSIONISE HERE. MOST JEWS FIND IT VERY OFFENSIVE.Because rejecting the Messiah is something that Jewish people have taken on as a cultural imperative.
Seriously, please go and post on a Christian Bible Study forum if you're not going to stick to the point. This thread is about Israel in the news, not what fanatical Christians believe in their egocentric and judgemental ramblings and how everyone else is wrong except for them.
I find such a story to be suspect at best! But even if it is a true story,
1) This is not a typical gay person--the HUGE majority of gay persons are NOT pedophiles;
2) Pedophilia is far more likely to be heterosexual in nature (I also get along quite well with coaches, though it seems that they are much more likely to engage in such behavior, as are Christian ministers and Christian camp counselors);
3) You failed to address Aviva's question regarding the prohibition on pork, which leads me to:
4) I still find it ironic that Christians pick and choose which laws are legit, and which ones they can conveniently ignore;
5) Finally, if G-d wants to smite someone, then G-d is more than capable of doing it without our help.
I am beginning to think that such a discussion is an attempt to proselytize. I am fine at religious discussion (i.e. is there a G-d, what are her qualities, etc...), but this seems to be very pointed, and one-sided; thus, it is offensive to me also.
I have no problem at all with discussing Christianity. I actually have a degree in theology and studied it in detail when I was at university.
But Deut 20-21's can't seem to say anything here without proselytising and tut-tutting in general over Jewish belief and tradition. On a discussion forum you make points that you can back up with hard factual evidence. That's what a debate is.
Looks like a good time was had by all.
All the nuts rolled over to California, as the saying goes. Truer words were never spoken.
First, with one exception which I don't need to identify, each of you has been very, no -- exceptionally kind, even generous, to me.
But we're going to continue to have this problem because this is the way I see things, this is simply the way I see the world, and I have some experiences that cause me to think that Israel's problems are not going to be resolved without some (a great deal, unfortunately,) of reflection and turmoil.
If it were my choice, if I had any authority, I'd order up the nukes for Iran. Again and again they have done nothing but cause trouble.
Yes, they were the victims of an aggressive Iraq in the '80s, but otherwise, consistently without exception or even a pause, all they do is to cause trouble for their neighbors. No, they cause trouble for everyone. Without relenting.
However as to my posting habit's -- I can't do better than I am doing.
So, I will wait a week, and not post. Someone (one of the site manager's,) tell me if I am welcome here.
BY the way: Do you remember when G. W. Bush said publicly that we all worship the same God?
This, more than anything else doomed his Presidency. GWB may be a Christian and he may be well intentioned (I think he was, very much so,) but that was a slap in the face to God. Worse, I think GWB knew otherwise but was doing what was politically necessary.
Now here's my point:
What I am saying I am saying because it's necessary. And you should rather I tell you the truth than be polite and politically expedient.
Deut 20- 21: Believe it or not, this message forum isn't personally about you. Or me. Or anyone. This message forum is about Israel, that is, Israel the world's only Jewish state. That's all that matters. If you want to rant about Jesus or about nuking Iran because G-d said so, it's a big internet out there.
But here we stick to the point. Sorry if that's hard for you. Being "kind and generous" is irrelevant, (which, by the way, is rich coming from a rabid homophobe!). Only the facts matter and if you can provide a solid argument to back them up. Or not.
Pork carries the disease trichinosis. I thought everybody knew that by now. It was unsafe to eat, therefore the prohibition. Many kosher laws were about health and hygiene as well as humaneness in killing animals for the purpose of food.
Now, health and hygiene has reached new lows, with factories and food processing plants delivering foods that aren't fit to eat because of various infestations, the latest being peanuts and salmonella, before that tomatoes infested with salmonella.
When I was in Israel, a friend got sick with cholera due to eating grapes that were grown with polluted water.
Everyone, everywhere through the centuries has to be aware of unsafe food. Even today, with our arsenal of medical care and medicines, people still die from salmonella poisoning.
Yes, please no proselytizing here. We've had enough of it from all sides. Indeed, a Christian Forum would welcome you with open arms.
Here is a place where one can be safe from the "nattering nabobs" that go on and on about the beautious and wonderious teachings of Christianity, of which most, if not all of it, is a dumbing down of the Old Testament.
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