Home | Huge betrayal?Originally Posted by bararallu
Turkish army has repeatedly warned Northern Iraqis not to shelter PKK and US to take action.Patience has a limit,so blame America (Bush administration),Barzani and Talabani, not Turkey.Turkey has an obligation to protect its borders and its citizens,if our NATO "ally" America can't do anything about the PKK and do nothing to prevent terrorist attacks from Northern Iraq then we have to take care of ourselves and our borders.
Last edited by Anatolia; 04-27-2009 at 10:23 AM.
Anatolia, US is not Israel. I'm Israeli. I also agree that the US and the Iraqi Kurds need to immediately destroy the PKK on their controlled territory. Every Israeli will agree with that.
Now, do you see it as a benefit to Turkey to align with thug regimes like Syria and Iran? Do you think it is to Turkeys advantage to put advisers and weapons into Lebanon, knowing that at least 1/2 of their military upper echelons are infiltrated by Syrian and Iranian agents, aside from the fact that half of the country is currently aligned with Iran willing and able to attack Israeli (as well as Lebanese non Shia) civilians? That is a serious problem for us.
I fail to see how encouraging failure leads to success. But then again, I think Machiavelli's "The Prince" is a comedy.
They don't,that's the problem.
I agree with you about Lebanon.And I understand Israel's concerns about Syria but you must also understand our concerns.Turkish-Syrian exercise has nothing to do with Israel,its all about PKK and Northern Iraq (at least from Turkey's perpective).As I said Northern Iraq is the basic source of the terror we face in Turkey.If Barzani&Talabani don't do anything to prevent terrorists from operating cross border attacks on Turkey from Iraq,and if America keep on ignoring our concerns then we have no other option. It's "if you don't cooperate with us in putting a stop to the PKK then we will find others to cooperate with us" issue.Now, do you see it as a benefit to Turkey to align with thug regimes like Syria and Iran? Do you think it is to Turkeys advantage to put advisers and weapons into Lebanon, knowing that at least 1/2 of their military upper echelons are infiltrated by Syrian and Iranian agents, aside from the fact that half of the country is currently aligned with Iran willing and able to attack Israeli (as well as Lebanese non Shia) civilians? That is a serious problem for us.
So again,blame Barzani,Talabani and America,they forced us to take such a step.
Ah - common!!!!! There were always Kurdish problems with your Barzanis and Talibanis.... for the past many decades.
Mil - stands for the countless MILlions of reasons not to work.
If Israel doesn't give in and doesn't make peace it'll be totally isolated in the world. Like Saddam's Iraq, without any real ally and lots of ennemies. And that's very dangerous but also means that Israel's behavior is going to change. Israel has long been unwilling to make any compromises because of unconditional US support and military supremacy. Now that both these are slowly faiding Israel will have to give in to reason.
And the problems are not over yet. Kurds want their independence, and Iraqi Kurds are independent in everything but name, tehy have an own flag, an own army, own border posts and other Iraqi can't enter their territory. (Talabani didn't speak to Iraq's prime minister for the last 7 months, enough said...). Soon the battle for Kirkuk and Mosul will erupt between Kurds and Arabs. And of course sooner or later they're going to help their Turkish Kurdish (and Iranian Kurdish) brothers. That's only natural. After all why should Iraqi Kurds deserve freedom and independence and Turkish or Iranian Kurds not? The Kurds were allies of the US because they fought Saddam. They can also prove to be allies against Iran and the new shiite regime in Baghdad. Before the US invaded Iraq they should have tought about these things.
Of course there's a dark advantage in it. Give in a bit to the Arab fascist tyrannies. Let them do what they do best and become brutal kingdoms, fascist police states. If anyone thinks the Palestinians of all people are going to be the first and only to leap over that phase and turn straight into Ireland then they are delusional. Worst case, the Palestinians get their nation state and devolve either into anarchic civil war or absolute totalitarianism. Oh the takeos of hte world will blame the Jews for all of that, but it won't matter any more than blaming the Jews for Burma or North Korea. Just another imploding failed state. Does anyone believe that Palestine will be more successful than Lebanon, that Iran won't move Hezbollah into the West Bank to take over? Does anyone believe that Palestine will be more successful than the Syrian police state, the Egyptian monarchy or Sudan, or Yemen?
Of course it won't. It will fail and there's nothing anyone can do about that. They've told the world they'd rather die than evolve. I say give them that chance.
You must be living in an alternate reality. Even Saeb Erekat disagrees with you:
source: http://www.israelforum.com/board/sho...7&postcount=16Palestinian Authority (PA) senior official and head of its negotiations
department, Saeb Erekat, has said in a detailed interview with an Arabic
newspaper that no Jews should be permitted to stay in a Palestinian state,
that Palestinians have an "absolute right" to the eastern half of Jerusalem
and that, as Israel's negotiating positions have weakened and been
concessionary over the years, the Palestinians should agree to nothing now
and allow Israel to concede still more.
Don't assume Israel will have to give in without US support. Not everyone is like the French. If Israel is weakened, then they cannot afford to take risks like giving up the strategic territories. Only a strong Israel can take risks for peace.
More likely Netanyahu will hold fast and wait for a new US president in 2012.
"If I forget thee, O Jerusalem, let my right hand wither, let my tongue cleave to my palate if I do not remember you, if I do not set Jerusalem above my highest joy." (Ps. 137: 5-7)"
"Any generation in which the Temple is not built, it is as if it had been destroyed in their times" (Yerushalmi, Yoma 1a).
NS, you're not new to the forum Dayag.
You must be living in an alternate reality.
"It is cheap to attack Israel. I am certainly not going to make a cheap attack on Israel by howling in the woods with the rest of the wolves." - Geert Wilders
i do not see it a big deal because Lebanon do not need the Turkish weapons
they have more than enough
More than enough for what?
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