150 000 march in London, against the Iraqi war and for freedom in Palestine

[freethepeeps]

Story here

and here

http://www.swp.org.uk/FRONT/stw28sep.gif

[ibrodsky]

An impressive number based on the police's estimate, which was much lower than the organizers'.

Unfortunately, impressive numbers of people have taken the wrong side on many occasions. Hitler rose to power legally: about 36% of Germans voted for the Nazis.

[Mediocrates]

But at this point you could have a rally against Fox Hunting....and the Palestinians.

It's the general purpose minor reason for everything.

Genetically modified fruit.....& Palestinians.

Better beer at football matches.......& Palestinians.

and so on.

[cerulean]

A week ago there was a march with over 400,000 (verified number) in London who were marching for "Liberty and Livelihood." They were marching, so far as I could see, for the right to have dogs tear foxes to pieces and get more government subsidies.

[freethepeeps]

Originally posted by cerulean
A week ago there was a march with over 400,000 (verified number) in London who were marching for "Liberty and Livelihood." They were marching, so far as I could see, for the right to have dogs tear foxes to pieces and get more government subsidies.

Yup, and I very much doubt that many of them were on todays march. But there are plenty who don't support hunting, nor US aggression to Iraq, nor Israeli occupation of Palestine.

[L@mplighterM]

A group of young supporters of the Hezbollah militia with painted faces carry toy guns during a demonstration in suburban Beirut, Lebanon, Friday, Sept. 27, 2002. Tens of thousands of Hezbollah supporters demonstrated to mark the second anniversary of the Palestinian intefadeh, or uprising.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp...168/2c3l1.html

[ibrodsky]

meanwhile, two Turkish men smuggling 34 pounds of Uranium were arrested in Turkey.

If it turns out this was weapons grade Uranium bound for Iraq, Britain will have the honor of being home to 150,000 appeasers of Arab tyrants seeking weapons of jihad-genocide mass destruction.

[peacelover]

If it turns out this was weapons grade Uranium bound for Iraq, Britain will have the honor of being home to 150,000 appeasers of Arab tyrants seeking weapons of jihad-genocide mass destruction.

but at least we won't be America with their self-righteous view of themselves as the poor little victims who will save the world from the sub-human Arabs, whose lives and wellbeing we musn't consider in our war - because they don't matter. Only what the US wants matters, so why are these silly little Europeans (God, how inferior to us they are!) trying to weigh up the cost to innocent Iraqi lives? Why are they acting like this matters? Why are they trying to push for a peaceful solution to the conflict? After all, we might as well go to war, it's not us who'll get killed when we bomb Baghdad.

[elke]

Originally posted by peacelover


but at least we won't be America with their self-righteous view of themselves as the poor little victims who will save the world from the sub-human Arabs, whose lives and wellbeing we musn't consider in our war - because they don't matter. Only what the US wants matters, so why are these silly little Europeans (God, how inferior to us they are!) trying to weigh up the cost to innocent Iraqi lives? Why are they acting like this matters? Why are they trying to push for a peaceful solution to the conflict? After all, we might as well go to war, it's not us who'll get killed when we bomb Baghdad.

Oh, come on, PeaceLover! You know full-well this is as far from the truth as it gets! Protection of American interests is the job of American government, just as protection of British interests is the job of the British one.

The reason behind US wanting to go to war with Iraq is to prevent Saddam from acquiring WMDs. Most of the world seems to be in agreement on this objective, in fact. The difference in opinion arises from the ways and means of achieving it, and not from the objective itself. The real questions are: Do you think that the inspectors will be able to find what they are looking for? After 4-year hiatus, which gave Saddam much needed time to hide what he wants where he wants it? Can anything short of getting rid of Saddam, achieve the goal of WMD-free Iraq? And - if the answer to #2 is "no", then - how can Saddam be deposed with minimal casualties on both sides?

[freethepeeps]

Originally posted by elke


Oh, come on, PeaceLover! You know full-well this is as far from the truth as it gets! Protection of American interests is the job of American government, just as protection of British interests is the job of the British one.

Would someone please tell Tony Blair this!

Also, in considering the Iraq question, it would be good if people remembered that 500 000 children are estimated to have lost their lives as a result of Western sanctions. If the claim is now that despite these sanctions Iraq has still managed to build up an arsenal, then 500 000+ people have already died in vain.

[elke]

Originally posted by freethepeeps


Would someone please tell Tony Blair this!

Also, in considering the Iraq question, it would be good if people remembered that 500 000 children are estimated to have lost their lives as a result of Western sanctions. If the claim is now that despite these sanctions Iraq has still managed to build up an arsenal, then 500 000+ people have already died in vain.

So, your proposal is that more innocent people die in vain because these unfortunates did?

[freethepeeps]

Originally posted by elke


So, your proposal is that more innocent people die in vain because these unfortunates did?

No - that is why I am opposed to the impending war!

[elke]

Originally posted by freethepeeps
No - that is why I am opposed to the impending war!

So what's your proposal?

[freethepeeps]

Originally posted by elke


So what's your proposal?

Quite honestly, I think Bush's fixation with Iraq is about revenge for his Daddy's Gulf War, and about getting control of the oil reserves.

Diplomatic endeavours have not been exhausted, and certainly should be before we start bombing the Iraqi people for their "freedom".

The idea that America can install a "regime of it's choosing" bodes ill for democracy everywhere, no? And it's my guess that any such regime would use very similar methods to control the Iraqi population.

I also can't understand what the hurry is, can you? There is no evidence that Hussein has the capability and it seems likely that if he did have it, he would use it now, rather than wait for the US to get its arse into gear and bomb him, possibly destroying his weapons in the process.

And yes, I know Hussein has done some awful things. I don't support him at all.

But GW is rather keen on frying people!

[peacelover]

Originally posted by elke


Oh, come on, PeaceLover! You know full-well this is as far from the truth as it gets! Protection of American interests is the job of American government, just as protection of British interests is the job of the British one.

The reason behind US wanting to go to war with Iraq is to prevent Saddam from acquiring WMDs. Most of the world seems to be in agreement on this objective, in fact. The difference in opinion arises from the ways and means of achieving it, and not from the objective itself. The real questions are: Do you think that the inspectors will be able to find what they are looking for? After 4-year hiatus, which gave Saddam much needed time to hide what he wants where he wants it? Can anything short of getting rid of Saddam, achieve the goal of WMD-free Iraq? And - if the answer to #2 is "no", then - how can Saddam be deposed with minimal casualties on both sides?

Elke:

it is no further from the truth than to say what Ibrodsky did.

I myself am not 100% opposed to war on Iraq - I just need more convincing that even if we did go to war, we could topple Saddam, and that this would be for the long-term good of Iraq and the world in general. I need convincing not only that Saddam has the capabilities to launch a nuclear strike, but also that he would choose to do so in peacetime on a civilian population. Possibly the proof exists, but I've never seen it.

But my response to Ibrodsky was because I am sick of the xenophobes on this board being so anti-Europe the whole time. When their countries are perfect, come back and see me, until then, they can shut the up.