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Thread: The Twelfth of July Orange Order parades in Northern Ireland on BBC and UTV Video Pla

  1. #1
    Senior Member Bill Sticker's Avatar
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    The Twelfth of July Orange Order parades in Northern Ireland on BBC and UTV Video Pla

    The Twelfth of July Orange Order parades in Northern Ireland on BBC and UTV Video Player channels



    BBC Morning Parade in Belfast
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode...th_13_07_2009/

    BBC Evening Parade Coverage
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode...elfth_Special/

    UTV Evening Parade Coverage
    http://www.u.tv/UTVMediaPlayer/Defau...x?vidid=123264

  2. #2
    Senior Member Kenneth's Avatar
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    Re: The Twelfth of July Orange Order parades in Northern Ireland on BBC and UTV Video

    Can't watch it.
    As a youth I used to weep in butcher's shops.

  3. #3
    Irish man
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    Re: The Twelfth of July Orange Order parades in Northern Ireland on BBC and UTV Video

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Sticker View Post
    The Twelfth of July Orange Order parades in Northern Ireland on BBC and UTV Video Player channels



    BBC Morning Parade in Belfast
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode...th_13_07_2009/

    BBC Evening Parade Coverage
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode...elfth_Special/

    UTV Evening Parade Coverage
    http://www.u.tv/UTVMediaPlayer/Defau...x?vidid=123264
    Who cares about an annual triumphalist parade which commemorates a battle in 1690 between two lots of people fighting for a Dutchman named Billy or something and it's aim is to annoy one section of the community? To 99% of Irish people it is amusing and childish and makes us scratch our heads as to why commemorate a battle fought so long ago.

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    Senior Member dayag's Avatar
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    Re: The Twelfth of July Orange Order parades in Northern Ireland on BBC and UTV Video

    Quote Originally Posted by Irish man View Post
    Who cares about an annual triumphalist parade which commemorates a battle in 1690 between two lots of people fighting for a Dutchman named Billy or something and it's aim is to annoy one section of the community? To 99% of Irish people it is amusing and childish and makes us scratch our heads as to why commemorate a battle fought so long ago.
    If the Palestinians are anything like the Orangemen, I guess we can look forward to Palestinian Nakba commemorations in the year 2267.

    I had a Southerner from the US tell me that the South didn't lose, they are just lulling the North into a false sense of security.

    But then again I will be observing Tisha b'Av this week, so who am I to talk?
    "If I forget thee, O Jerusalem, let my right hand wither, let my tongue cleave to my palate if I do not remember you, if I do not set Jerusalem above my highest joy." (Ps. 137: 5-7)"

    "Any generation in which the Temple is not built, it is as if it had been destroyed in their times" (Yerushalmi, Yoma 1a).

  5. #5
    Irish man
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    Re: The Twelfth of July Orange Order parades in Northern Ireland on BBC and UTV Video

    Quote Originally Posted by dayag View Post
    If the Palestinians are anything like the Orangemen, I guess we can look forward to Palestinian Nakba commemorations in the year 2267.

    I had a Southerner from the US tell me that the South didn't lose, they are just lulling the North into a false sense of security.

    But then again I will be observing Tisha b'Av this week, so who am I to talk?
    The Orange parades are getting smaller every year and they will disappear soon, I feel. The intelligent folk do not participate in those silly parades anymore.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Bill Sticker's Avatar
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    Re: The Twelfth of July Orange Order parades in Northern Ireland on BBC and UTV Video

    The Tourist board of Northern Ireland is now promoting the Twelfth of July Orange celebrations in Ulster and have found it a great visitor attraction, and most successful enterprise as the 18 associated parades are provided free of charge to them and are such an amazing spectacle of colour music and variety.

    And talking of the Orange parades there were approximately 3000 such parades this year all across Northern Ireland during the annual walks here. Of these only about five are considered contentious parades. In ALL cases the violence associated and highly publicised DID NOT EVEN ONCE COME FROM THE ORANGE BRETHREN but those groups who opposed us. This can be confirmed by the police.

    This year in particular saw a coalition of republican dissident extremeists, bus in rioters from all over Ulster as testified to by even official Sinn Fein who rioted and wrecked for three days allegedly because of a 10 minute Orange parade via a main road through the Ardoyne. The rioters were aged from 10 to 20 years old. Official Sinn Fein organised a completely peaceful protest but the dissidents turned it into a turf war with them causing the subsequent riots to occour.

    We had visitors this year from Ghana from where we welcomed several African brethren full members of the Orange and Royal Black Preceptory of Ghana from that jurisdiction who took part as our guests in our parades here.

    We believe strongly in civil and religious liberty for all men with privledge for none and no action of ours is ever designed to cause or provoke trouble of any kind and only those who go out of their way to be provoked are affected.

    In fact Official Sinn Fein candidate in Craigavon this year John Odowd usually comes out to "monitor" the annual Lurgan twelfth Orange parade. This year he did not appear and the reason as he told police later was because there was no point as nothing ever happens while it is taking place.

    It is also our quest to continue and further develop social and responsible citizenship, in order to maintain, and enhance greater and higher standards of Justice, Truth, Honesty, and Integrity in both private and public life.

    Our primary purpose therefore is not as was wrongly claimed hatred of anyone, but instead to stand up for and promote the reformed Protestant tradition and exersise our human rights of freedom of assembly and process in order to allow us to do this.


    Its like a united ireland thats been happening since 1690 and the voices advocating that are also getting fainter. The shinners are as popular in the Irish Republic as somthing you might step in crossing a cow field so now they are scrabbling around for anyone they imagine might listen to their pathetic pitch about their united ireland.

    It wont ever happen because the South isnt interested the people there are so sick of the place anyway they flock into Newry in the UK to spend their Euros rather than be ripped off at home.

    They dont want the expense of running here either

  7. #7
    Senior Member Kenneth's Avatar
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    Re: The Twelfth of July Orange Order parades in Northern Ireland on BBC and UTV Video

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Sticker View Post
    ...It wont ever happen because the South isnt interested the people there are so sick of the place anyway they flock into Newry in the UK to spend their Euros rather than be ripped off at home....
    That particular stick we use on retailers in the Republic will be missed, if, or when unification occurs.
    As a youth I used to weep in butcher's shops.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Bill Sticker's Avatar
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    Re: The Twelfth of July Orange Order parades in Northern Ireland on BBC and UTV Video

    At the last couple of election in the Republic Sinn Fein the cheerleaders for Irish Unity or as we in Ulster look upon it IRAsh unity have had an unremittingly poor showing and its getting worse.

    This time out they LOST their only Euro MEP Mary Lou Mcdonald (The one who delivered the oration in fawning praise of Sinn Feins Nazi wartime leader Sean Ocallaghans monstrosity of a statue) and at the last count eight of their activists have quit the party over the head of their catastrophically abysmal showing.

    It prompted one of them to lament that if they cannot win elections when the Irish economy is going down the toilet when can they win. The Irish voter is more interested in the green in his wallet that the green in his heart.

    So Gerry is running around the globe like a headless chicken banging his green drum in a pathetic attempt to revive at leaast a modicum of feigned interest in the faithful and anyone else he can corner in a room long enough to listen to his tales of misty boggy mornings the auld sod is headig for just around the corner.

    I can nearly smell the peat fire burning in the thatched cottages now!

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++
    It was not a surprise Sinn Fein did so badly in last week's general election, Irish Foreign Minister Dermot Ahern has claimed.

    Mr Ahern said young people in the Republic were "not tuned in to a party with Marxist socialist policies".

    The election returned Fianna Fail as the largest party but without an overall majority.

    Irish Prime Minister Bertie Ahern will begin work this week on the formation of a new government.

    The taoiseach hopes he can form a coalition with the much-reduced Progressive Democrats and a number of independents.

    Sinn Fein, which lost one of its five Dail seats, has been ruled out as a coalition partner by Fianna Fail.

    'Economic issues'

    Foreign Affairs Minister Dermot Ahern said he was not surprised at Sinn Fein's poor showing.

    "I was always confident... when we got Sinn Fein into a situation where we were talking about bread and butter issues, talking about economic issues," he said.

    "People saw that a party that has a Marxist, a socialist philosophy is not really in tune, particularly with the younger population who are all working, have cars, go on holidays and are trying to buy a house."

    Fianna Fail secured 78 seats in the 166-seat assembly, but saw a decline in the vote of its previous coalition partners, the Progressive Democrats.

    Mr Ahern now faces the prospect of tough talks with opposition parties to build a coalition government.

    Coalition

    He can count on two independents and two surviving Progressive Democrats.

    The main opposition Fine Gael polled well, winning 51 seats, but its potential coalition partners Labour and the Greens fared less well.

    As a result, not even these three parties combined could overtake Fianna Fail and the PDs.

    The Republic of Ireland's system of proportional representation means that parties' representation in the Dail (lower house of parliament) closely matches their percentage of the vote.

    The taoiseach has led a coalition government since 1997 - a period of sustained economic growth for the Republic.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Bill Sticker's Avatar
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    Re: The Twelfth of July Orange Order parades in Northern Ireland on BBC and UTV Video

    Nothing humorous about Republic’s troubled times
    http://www.irishnews.com/articles/54...Nothinghu.html
    By Fergal Hallahan The Friday Column 24/07/09

    During the Troubles the news from the north was relentlessly grim – so much so that it cemented, perhaps forever, the general feeling in the Republic that we were as well-off out of it. Now the roles have been reversed – news from the south is bleak and serious to the point of being almost unbearable. Construction in collapse; banks bailed out; dysfunctional

    health care; report after report into child abuse, then senior-citizen abuse; business empires in liquidation; factory closures; mass lay-offs; household incomes slashed – hundreds of thousands of individuals’ experiences of the economic landslide translated into a daily inventory of negativity.

    Clearly the north, with its own spiralling unemployment, businesses going to the wall and a similarly bust housing market, is feeling the pain too. But the carnage in the Republic seems to be of a different order. In fact it’s a relief to be living in the north now, on the opposite side of the border once again to where the really scary stuff is happening.

    Last week the Irish government published the McCarthy report, which outlines in stark terms ways “to get this nation back on track”, as finance minister Brian Lenihan put it. With the state’s finances in freefall, in November the minister established the Special Group on Public Service Numbers and Expenditure Programmes, headed by UCD economist Colm McCarthy, to review public spending and come up with cost-saving measures.

    The situation it was faced with was and remains deadly serious – the shortfall between government spending and revenue this year is projected to be more than ?20 billion (£17bn). With the state borrowing ?400 million (£343m) a week for day-to-day spending, the McCarthy group’s remit was to come up with a formula for balancing the Republic’s books by 2011 – a task that could only be achieved in such a timeframe by radical means.

    An Bord Snip Nua (the new snip board), as the body has become known in the south, has gone even further than it was asked to, proposing cuts to the value of £5.3bn in annual expenditure, most of which could be delivered next year, it says.

    To achieve this extraordinary claw-back it recommends reducing the public-sector workforce by 17,300. It earmarks agencies for merger, rationalisation or privatisation and says some should be done away with altogether. It advises selling surplus state land and assets; cutting arts and sports funding; abolishing farming grants; shutting two government departments; closing army barracks; halving the number of Garda stations; cuts in education, health and public transport – and on and on.


    Reaction has been incandescent. Farmers hanged an effigy of the agriculture minister, while suggestions that social welfare be cut, schools amalgamated and pupil-teacher ratios increased have been met with outrage and incredulity. These are unsubtle slash-and-burn tactics that will further disadvantage society’s most vulnerable, it is argued. On the other hand, some commentators have suggested the McCarthy report offers a once-in-a-generation opportunity to get things right in the economy.

    Perhaps some years hence, when those of its recommendations that are implemented have bedded in, the Republic might well resemble a Scandinavian state, with streamlined public services and officials who are competent, accountable and realistically remunerated. But it’s difficult to see that happening.

    Given time for due consideration and the working out of difficulties, the McCarthy report might well serve as a basis for better policy-making. However, while it seems impressively thorough and in many respects reasonable, it was, of necessity, a rushed job. It is a set of suggestions for saving money fast, not a blueprint for government.

    Also, the tendency in many areas of Irish life, not least southern politics, to take the short-term view means coherence and cohesiveness will likely be jettisoned along with those elements of the report that are deemed politically unpalatable. If building a better – ie more equitable and efficient – state were ever on the agenda there would have been evidence of it in the boom years. There wasn’t.

    If no grand plan for a fairer society existed then, anybody who thinks it’s going to come about now, as a fortuitous side-effect of the An Bord Snip Nua report, is kidding themselves.

    Come to think of it, anyone who, confronted with the hard medicine that the south is going to have to swallow, can make up a ‘humorous’ name for those filling out the prescription, is kidding themselves too.

    It seems a lot of people haven’t yet grasped that it’s not one bit funny.

  10. #10
    ranchcer
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    Re: The Twelfth of July Orange Order parades in Northern Ireland on BBC and UTV Video

    Once Ireland is reunited, the Orange Parade may well be just another colourful and profitable tourist attraction. If some still perceive as an anti-roman catholic march, why not stage their own parade? say the french victory over the Brits in the Hundred Years " War, with beautiful women riding great Irish Horses like Joan of Arc

  11. #11
    Senior Member Bill Sticker's Avatar
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    Re: The Twelfth of July Orange Order parades in Northern Ireland on BBC and UTV Video

    The Republic of Ireland broke away from the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland. If they wish to rejoin it then they need to make their case.

    The people of the Irish Republic have effectively rejected Sinn Fein if favour of more normal bread and butter political parties.

    If you think that the evil sectarian campaign Sinn Fein waged against the Protestant people of Ulster persuaded even one loyalist that a united Ireland was a good idea then yove got me stumped

    Quotations from Sean Ocallaghan one time Chief of Staff of the Provisional IRA

    "Republicanism traditionally spoke of uniting Catholic Protestant and dissenter under the common nane of Irishman, yet the Provisional IRA used a parochial house to induct local men into the IRA" Young largely uneducated lads were brought to the priests house at night to be sworn in. The local priest was more than likely the same priest who heard their confession, whose mass they attended and all the while they knew their priest actively supported the IRA. What kind of effect did this have on them? Could they really be expected to believe their churches denounciation of the IRA was without ambiguity.


    "The truth is that I had come to Northern Ireland abysmally ignorant of the realities and yet prepared to kill and bomb. the Provisional IRA was a Catholic defense organization and I wasn't even a practising Catholic!"

  12. #12
    Senior Member bararallu's Avatar
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    Re: The Twelfth of July Orange Order parades in Northern Ireland on BBC and UTV Video

    Bill,

    What happens in the case where devolution takes it's course in the UK? Where does the Orange Order / movement stand on that scenario. Assuming it happens, and obviously its an 'if' not an 'when' sort of thing. Some European conflicts seem to be given to this sort of sovereignty erosion (threats from without are a different story of course). The Basque, the Catalanese, the Corsicans etc... can essentially have complete local jurisdiction whilst playing lip service to the next level of government, which may or may not become redundant.

    I'm not advocating the dissolution of sovereignty BTW, just gaging trends...

  13. #13
    Senior Member Bill Sticker's Avatar
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    Re: The Twelfth of July Orange Order parades in Northern Ireland on BBC and UTV Video

    Well it may be off to a shaky start but we do have the makings of devolved administration at Stormont right now.

    Currently its a carve up between the DUP and Sinn Fein. When things settle more and the real threat by dissident republicans is fully dissapated I think there will emerge a peaceful Northern Ireland where the right of the majority here both Roman Catholic and Protestant who consistently vote for being British will be respected.

    The Irish Republic currently in a deep trough financially speaking is still not reached the bottom of its disaterous reliance on the building trade to prop up its economy and being in the Euro zone has exacerbated those problems.

    The new NAMA rescue package which hopes to transfer toxic debts currently in the hands of the property tycoons for secure Irish government securities is a very hurried and essentially kneejerk measure to a crisis which her politicians have neither the brains nor the political stomach to tackle in the manner it really would require. The austerity measures needed would not go down at all well with the Irish electorate.

    Also as an Ulsterman I have watched with disbelief as that state which for donkeys years has been ruled by to quote the old Irish tounge in cheek phrase "straigh na pusig" or in English "Up the Bishops Staircase" has been rocked to its core by the 60 years of Irish state sponsored clerical abuse scandals presided over by the Roman Catholic church.

    The Irish government actually rode a coach and horses through its own constitution in order to bail the RC church out. The constitution guarantees that the state is incompetent to endow a particular religion yet it made several billion euro availible to save the RC church from the crippling compenasation claims by thousands of its priests young victims.

    No i'm afraid that talk of a united ireland any time soon is nothing more than misty eyed blarney and thats for as far into the future as any of us alive today could care to look!!

    Irish State Collusion in Abuse scandalshttp://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle6328015.ece
    MOVIE
    FULL REPORT HERE
    http://www.childabusecommission.ie/

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