I'm a Peace activist.

[farmboy]

This was a statement made by a new member in an earlier post, which has given me cause for thought over the past few days.
For some reason 'Peace Activism" seems to be the captive of the left and far left. When the term Peace Activist is used, we automatically jump to a conclusion that this person is left wing. Somehow the people who want a peace that is realistic and will stand the test of time, are considered warmongers, and are labled right wing.
I'm a peace activist but there are few who would be as far right as I consider myself. My belief is that peace between Palestinian arab and Jew can only be achieved under a Jewish Hedgemony. The leftist belief is that if you give the arabs everything they will start to love you and through that peace will be achieved. It seems that for the last 64 years the leftists have dictated the terms and yet their policies have brought nothing but death and prolonged the status of arab against Jew, so how could they even consider themselves Peace Activists?
So are you a peace activist?

[Kachah]

Don't you know? War is Peace, Freedom is Slavery and Ignorance is Strength. Nothing new.

[Pleepleus]

Israel has been ruled by both right wing and left wing coalitions during its almost 64 year history. Both sides think the other side will bring the country to disaster. Both are probably right.

[Aliyah1995]

Nothing new here. It is always the far-left that claim to be fighting for human rights and universal brotherhood, yet end up committing acts of oppression no less (if not more) than religious extremists or fascist regimes.

For example, look at the communist regime in the former Soviet Union. They outlawed religion in general (and Judaism specifically) in the name of "universalism". Religion is nonsense, only causes bloodshed, all human are equal, we need to eliminate the superstition of religion, belief in a deity/deities, and primitive traditions in favor of logic and enlightenment, etc. etc. Only in the process, they ended up oppressing a heck of a lot more people than they helped. I'm sure Natan Sharansky can tell you a thing or two about the "benefits" of communist universal brotherhood, citizen of the world horse manure.

My great grandparents (all 8 of them) fled from Poland and Russian not because of religious extremism (Christian or Muslim) but because of communist oppression.

So why should we be surprised by today's Green Party and Code Pink movements? If they had their way there would basically be an English speaking version of the KGB.

[Kachah]

Nothing new here. It is always the far-left that claim to be fighting for human rights and universal brotherhood, yet end up committing acts of oppression no less (if not more) than religious extremists or fascist regimes..

Aliyah, the Fascists ARE left. Religious extremists can be either.
As far as the peace activism is concerned, the biggest slaughter in the world's history- WW2 - was started by the two most left political regimes. The correlation between the left and war is well known and has many examples (the Democrats started Vietnam war, the Republicans stopped it etc etc)

For example, look at the communist regime in the former Soviet Union. They outlawed religion in general (and Judaism specifically) in the name of "universalism"..

That's not entirely correct. The left cannot afford the existence of an alternative ideology - that's why they outlaw religion and everything else. AS much as the left hate the right - they hate more the left of a different kind. The sunni hate the shia first and foremost and only then - everybody else (and vice versa). The Labor hate the Greens, the nazis hate the commies and so forth. Hitler and Stalin ended up at each other throats while the differences between their versions of socialism were barely noticeable. There is not much room at the left to accommodate more than one "theory". But - this theory can change to adapt to th enew conditions while remaining the "only correct one". By the 1942 the religion in the USSR was back - the commies had an urgent need. The teachings were still correct. All possible deviation have to be purged ruthlessly at all times, hence the Gulags. Basically, the Gulags were full of people who said "but yesterday you were telling us a different story".

[Madeline]

Peace, what a noble concept...if all are willing to play by the rules.
So I consider myself a realist who wishes for peace.

[Pleepleus]

Aliyah, the Fascists ARE left. ...

Wrong, Kachah. The Fascists, Nazis, and their ideological descendants such as the NPD in Germany are decidedly Right wing. That is why Hitler was so strongly supported by the Industrialists and Bankers in Germany.

Totalitarian regimes differ from older concepts of dictatorship or tyranny. Totalitarian regimes seek to establish complete political, social and cultural control, whereas dictatorships seek limited, typically political, control. Two types of totalitarianism can sometimes be distinguished: Nazism and Fascism which evolved from "right-wing" extremism, and Communism, which evolved from "left-wing" extremism. Traditionally, each is supported by different social classes. Right-wing totalitarian movements have generally drawn their popular support primarily from middle classes seeking to maintain the economic and social status quo. Left-wing totalitarianism has often developed from working class movements seeking, in theory, to eliminate, not preserve, class distinctions. Right-wing totalitarianism has typically supported and enforced the private ownership of industrial wealth. A distinguishing feature of Communism, by contrast, is the collective ownership of such capital.

http://remember.org/guide/Facts.root.nazi.html

[Shl]

Aliyah, the Fascists ARE left. Religious extremists can be either.

Not so. Fascists are the extreme right not left. Extreme left (communism) is quite decidedly anti-religion so religious extremists are usually found either in a group of their own (fundamentalism) or more toward the right.

Having said that however, it also needs to be said that right and left are not linear but circular. i.e imagine a circle on the right side is the "democratic right", on the left side is the "democratic left" on the top are the "liberals" on the bottom are "radical totalitarianists" the very bottom are totalitarian right and totalitarian left right next to each other. The more radical people get on either side of the spectrum the more similar they get to each other (although they will gladly kill each other any chance they get).

I think what you mistake for "left" is the totalitarianism of both the fascists and the communists. Totalitarianism however is neither right nor left it is the opposite of liberalism, i.e totalitarianism is a system where the government's power is absolute, the ideal of liberalism is a system where the government has (almost-) no power while both the democratic right and left seek a balance between government and people (they just have very opposed views on what the government should and should not interfere with).

[Madeline]

Fascists aren't necessarily religious extremists.
Once we get past the more obvious Google offerings, and dig down deeper, we will find that, yes, fascism comes in many forms....those who wish to do away with what is not pleasing or conducive to their way of life, restricts their every desire, or limits their power over others.

A system of government marked by centralization of authority under a dictator, stringent socioeconomic controls, suppression of the opposition through terror ...

Here in America, both left and right seek interference into every aspect of our being, and have therefor fascist tendencies.
Every Government which seeks to dictate what we can, and cannot, do, is fascist, and so are those who think themselves as liberated, liberal left leaning, while all they wish to do is to force their desire on others, except they call it a civil right, quickly involving civil liberty unions to legislate, while failing to tolerate the fundamental beliefs of others..

[farmboy]

I must admit that this Left, Right thing really confuses me. I know that I'm right wing because I believe in the same things that most professed right wingers do such as bringing back hanging and opposing violence with a greater force. But then I also see myself as really liberal, where I believe in the equality in respect for women, that the downtroden should be helped to get out of their holes, and free medical treatment should be everyones right.
Does the love of freedom without government interference make me right or left? The post by Shl seems to make sense that the extremes almost meet at the ends.
http://www.israelnationalnews.com/Ne...4#.T1IGdHn8-vU

About 80 Palestinian Authority Arabs and leftist activists rioted on Friday afternoon in the village of Nabi Saleh near Neve Tzuf.

Strange bedfellows. Right wing arabs and left wing Jews and yet it works for them.

[Shl]

I must admit that this Left, Right thing really confuses me. I know that I'm right wing because I believe in the same things that most professed right wingers do such as bringing back hanging and opposing violence with a greater force. But then I also see myself as really liberal, where I believe in the equality in respect for women, that the downtroden should be helped to get out of their holes, and free medical treatment should be everyones right.
Does the love of freedom without government interference make me right or left? The post by Shl seems to make sense that the extremes almost meet at the ends.

The love of freedom without government interference makes you "liberal", but only in the original sense of the meaning of the laissez-faire capitalists of the 19th century. I think the big confusion particularly in the US today is that the Democrats who are anything but "liberal" are called "Liberals".
But I agree, if you have an opinion of your own, rather than just following the "party line" it is very difficult to fit into these archaic models of "right" and "left". Politics has stayed static for the last 100 years, while society went through profound changes. I think this is also the problem why many democracies today have such a poor showing of voters... there is the (very understandable) "what for" attitude that who ever you vote for will just mess things up for you one way or another.

http://www.israelnationalnews.com/Ne...4#.T1IGdHn8-vU

Strange bedfellows. Right wing arabs and left wing Jews and yet it works for them.

Not really that strange. Left wing Jews are in favor of the land for peace attempts even though they never worked, so they are willing to give what the right wing Arabs are asking for... so as long as they continue to forget to ask for something in return they should get along just fine.