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Thread: Jerusalem

  1. #31
    Leon Uris
    Guest

    Thumbs up

    This is the FIRST time on the forum that I have seen such a statement. I think the powers that be have come to realize that there is no such thing as a moderate Islam. Yes, there may be moderate muslims who are such inherently decent human beings that even a retrograde and bloodthirsty faith like islam could not affect them. But by and large, all muslims completely believe in killing innocents in the name of islam, as the koran mandates, even when the non-muslims may be as harmless as buddhist monks living on alms.

    I hope that such honesty continues to be the hall-mark of this forum. We, in India, and even in the US, continue to subscribe to this absurd "peaceful islam" notion that is an inherent contradiction.

    http://www.israelforum.com/dynamix/page.pl?sn=119



    The concept of slaughtering the infidel is a basic tenet of Islam, as prescribed in the Quran.

  2. #32
    Senior Member Mediocrates's Avatar
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    Yes the one thing that Arafat's Murder, Inc. has managed to do is finally drive away that one segment of the Israeli population who might be counted on to work with him for so called peace. What PLOistan is facing now is one big radicalized Israel.

  3. #33
    Blueprint
    Guest

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Logical Proof, Islam DOES SUPPORT Terrorism

    Originally posted by IlyaFurman
    THOSE GUYS THAT CELEBTRATE ARE STUPID, ABOUT 400 MUSLIMS DIED IN WTC, DID YOU KNOW THAT OR CHOOSE TO IGNORE THAT???
    Since 400 Muslims died in the WTC attacks, that somehow negates that millions of them celebrated it? I don't get it.

  4. #34
    Blueprint
    Guest
    IS THIS GUY A SCHOLAR OR ANYTHING???
    Are you a scholar? If not, why should we listen to you? So, your basically saying your opinion counts none, right?

    I thought so.

  5. #35
    IlyaFurman
    Guest
    Originally posted by Blueprint
    Are you a scholar? If not, why should we listen to you? So, your basically saying your opinion counts none, right?

    I thought so.
    I dont suppose im a scholar but I contribute, I am my friend own a website about how christianity tricks jews into christianity, link should be in my sig.

    And I help run a art expo, solely based on jewish people and jewish subjects in works of art. Our main attractions are -

    Ex - "nahash the ammonite threatening the jews at jabesh", the orginal is in a paris musem, but we have the copy at the expo, where a christian knight is threating and poking fun at old jewish rabbis

    and spoils from the temple of jerusalem

    http://rubens.anu.edu.au/htdocs/surv...01/000128A.JPG
    http://rubens.anu.edu.au/htdocs/surv...01/000129B.JPG

    this scence depicts jews being tortured and hung and killed, we have copies of painting like that and similar to that, to show history.

    I might not be a scholar, but I know that sometimes we sound like the people we hate the most, I know alot of muslims, and they have helped me and my family in times of need, so I really dont like the sterotyping of ANY race religion or creed.

  6. #36
    abu afak
    Guest

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Logical Proof, Islam DOES SUPPORT Terrorism

    Originally posted by Blueprint
    Since 400 Muslims died in the WTC attacks, that somehow negates that millions of them celebrated it? I don't get it.
    Ex from Letter to the Editor of WSJ


    "...In 1990, when Saddam Hussein invaded Kuwait, I was watching TV with some non-Arab Muslims. When they saw Saddam's tanks roll into Kuwait, they cheered. I'm not easily shocked by the inanities of Muslims (I've seen too much of them in my lifetime), but this was too much even for me. I screamed, "What the hell is wrong with you? He's just invaded a Muslim country and is slaughtering its inhabitants!"

    That didn't matter. What mattered was that Big Daddy Saddam, the new Saladin, was sticking it to the Crusaders. And criticisms like mine were fit only for--that's right, quislings.

    So: A pseudo-Muslim Arab leader invades an Arab Muslim country, rapes and slaughters its inhabitants, and plunders its wealth. Meanwhile, non-Arab Muslims cheer him on, as though he were Saladin (the Kurd). Of course, after the war, Saddam goes out and annihilates the Muslim population of Kurds...""

    Irfan Khawaja - Princeton, N.J.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    PS- Palestinians and alot of the 'Arab street' were also cheering

  7. #37
    reason
    Guest

    Re: Logical Proof, Islam DOES SUPPORT Terrorism

    We read (IX. 5-6):“Kill those who join other gods with God wherever you may find them”;

    IV.76: “Those who believe fight in the cause of God”;

    VIII.39-42: “Say to the Infidels: if they desist from their unbelief, what is now past shall be forgiven; but if they return to it, they have already before them the doom of the ancients! Fight then against them till strife be at an end, and the religion be all of it God’s.”

    Those who die fighting for the only true religion, Islam, will be amply rewarded in the life to come:

    IV.74: “Let those who fight in the cause of God who barter the life of this world for that which is to come; for whoever fights on God’s path, whether he is killed or triumphs, We will give him a handsome reward.”

    What should we make with these further unfortunate verses from the Qur’an:

    *Torment to Non-believers->IV.56
    *Only Islam Acceptable-> III.85
    * No friends from outsiders->III.118
    *No friends with Jews, christians->V. 51
    * No friends with non believers->IV.144, III.28
    * No friends with parents/siblings if not believers->IX.23
    * Fight non-believers->IX.123 * Kill non-believers->IV.89
    *Anti Jewish verses->V.82
    * God a "plotter"->VIII.30
    *Killing Idolators->IX.5
    * Idolators are unclean just because they are idolator->IX.28
    * Forcing non-believers to pay tax->IX.29
    * The Torment of Hell->XLIV.43-58
    * All except Muslims/Jews/Christians/Sabeans will go to hell->II.62, V.69
    * Cast terror in the hearts, smite the neck and cut fingertips of unbelievers->VIII.12
    * Smite the neck of unbelievers->XLVII.4
    * Severe Punishment for atheists->X.4 ; V.10 ; V.86
    * Severe Punishment for non-believers->XXII.19-22 ; LXXII.23, XCVIII.6
    *Punishing non-believers of Hereafter->XVII.10
    * Punishing for rejecting faith->III.91
    * Non believers go to hell->IV.140 ; VII.36 * Partial Believers go to hell too->IV.150-1
    * Sadistic punishments->LVI.42-43
    * Punishment for apostates->XVI.106 ; III.86-88 ; III.90 ; IV.137.
    * Threat of punishement for not going to war->IX.38-39, XLVIII.16
    *God making someone more sinful so he can be punished more->III178
    *Intentionally preventing unbelievers from knowing the truth->VI.25 ; VI.110
    * Intentionally preventing unbelievers from Understanding Quran->XVII.45-46
    * It is God who causes people to err and He punishes them for that->XVII.97
    * God could guide, if he chose to, but did not->VI.35
    * Intentionally misguiding those whom he pleases to->XIV.4
    * Willfully misguiding some->XVI.93
    * God causes human to err->IV.143 ; VII.178
    * God deceiving humans->IV.142


    Im gonna try and reply to every single verse this guy quotes.

    This is [9:5] Once the Sacred Months are past, (and they refuse to make peace) you may kill the idol worshipers when you encounter them, punish them, and resist every move they make. If they repent and observe the Contact Prayers (Salat) and give the obligatory charity (Zakat), you shall let them go. GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful. So 9:6 is talking about those who refuse to make peace.

    [4:75] Why should you not fight in the cause of GOD when weak men, women, and children are imploring: "Our Lord, deliver us from this community whose people are oppressive, and be You our Lord and Master." So 4:76, 4:74 are taken out of context (funny the author quotes 4:74 and 4:76 but dosnt even mention 4:75!!!) . So the three verses put togther mean, Fight those non believers who are oppresive and fight for tyranny.

    This is [8:39] You shall fight them to ward off oppression, and to practice your religion devoted to GOD alone. If they refrain from aggression, then GOD is fully Seer of everything they do .So 8:39 -8:42 is talking about those who transgress.Further proof that Islam is non violent.

    This is [4:56] Surely, those who disbelieve in our revelations, we will condemn them to the hellfire. Whenever their skins are burnt, we will give them new skins. Thus, they will suffer continuously. GOD is Almighty, Most Wise. The Bible and the Torah are revelations.

    [3:85] Anyone who accepts other than Submission as his religion, it will not be accepted from him, and in the Hereafter, he will be with the losers. Submission to god , jews and christians believe in god. Now we start to see a pattern here, the author is a bigot.

    [3:118] O you who believe, do not befriend outsiders who never cease to wish you harm; they even wish to see you suffer. Hatred flows out of their mouths and what they hide in their chests is far worse. We thus clarify the revelations for you, if you understand. And who in his right mind wants to befriend strangers who want to cause him harm?


    [5:51] O you who believe, do not take certain Jews and Christians as allies; these are allies of one another. Those among you who ally themselves with these belong with them. GOD does not guide the transgressors
    *5:51 Relations with other people are governed by the basic rule in 5:57 & 60:8-9. The Jews and Christians who cannot be friends are specifically mentioned in 5:57; they are the ones who mock and ridicule the believers, or attack them.

    [4:144] O you who believe, you shall not ally yourselves with the disbelievers, instead of the believers. Do you wish to provide GOD with a clear proof against you? And this is bad because? Dont make allies with non believers instead of the believers, but it dosnt say dont take allies with non-believers!(note the author says friends, which is a lie in the first place) same thing goes for 3:28.

    [9:23] O you who believe, do not ally yourselves even with your parents and your siblings, if they prefer disbelieving over believing. Those among you who ally themselves with them are transgressing. This verse is talking to the people at the time of the prophet because[9:20] Those who believe, and emigrate, and strive in the cause of GOD with their money and their lives, are far greater in rank in the sight of GOD. These are the winners. Note the emigrate or higra the time when Mohamed and his followers went to medina to escape prosecution from those Parents and Siblings.

    [9:123] O you who believe, you shall fight the disbelievers who attack you - let them find you stern - and know that GOD is with the righteous. The verse is self explainatory "who attack you".The author has forsaken any scholastic integrity he might have had when he wrote this article.

    [8:30] The disbelievers plot and scheme to neutralize you, or kill you, or banish you. However, they plot and scheme, but so does GOD. GOD is the best schemer. The verse is for the prophet, and god is a schemer and that is bad why?

    [9:5] Once the Sacred Months are past, (and they refuse to make peace) you may kill the idol worshipers when you encounter them, punish them, and resist every move they make. If they repent and observe the Contact Prayers (Salat) and give the obligatory charity (Zakat), you shall let them go. GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful. How is this bad!!! This is the most tolerance I have seen.

    [9:28] O you who believe, the idol worshipers are polluted; they shall not be permitted to approach the Sacred Masjid after this year. If you fear loss of income, GOD will shower you with His provisions, in accordance with His will. GOD is Omniscient, Most Wise. And? Muslims believe Idolers have polluted souls and shouldnt come close to their Sacred mosques.

    The rest of the verses I have replied to in a reply to l@mplighter who also used many of these verses. In conclusion, These verses have all been distorted and taken out of context. The author is a lying bigot with no integrity whatsoever.

  8. #38
    abu afak
    Guest

    Re: Re: Logical Proof, Islam DOES SUPPORT Terrorism

    ................Im gonna try and reply to every single verse this guy quotes. ""

    This is [9:5] Once the Sacred Months are past, (and they refuse to make peace) you may kill the idol worshipers when you encounter them, punish them, and resist every move they make. If they repent and observe the Contact Prayers (Salat) and give the obligatory charity (Zakat), you shall let them go. GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful. So 9:6 is talking about those who refuse to make peace............
    AND WHO MIGHT THAT BE .. JEWS, CHRISTIANS, AND HINDUS, THEY ARE FIGHTING EVERYWHERE ISLAM EXISTS?

    [4:75] Why should you not fight in the cause of GOD when weak men, women, and children are imploring: "Our Lord, deliver us from this community whose people are oppressive, and be You our Lord and Master." So 4:76, 4:74 are taken out of context (funny the author quotes 4:74 and 4:76 but dosnt even mention 4:75!!!) . So the three verses put togther mean, Fight those non believers who are oppresive and fight for tyranny.........
    YOU MEAN EVERYONE THEY THEY WANT TO SAY IS TYRANNICAL... IN FACT TYRANNY IS A SPECIALTY BY ISLAMIC GOVERMENTS TO THEIR MINORITY SUBJECTS

    This is [8:39] You shall fight them to ward off oppression, and to practice your religion devoted to GOD alone. If they refrain from aggression, then GOD is fully Seer of everything they do .So 8:39 -8:42 is talking about those who transgress.Further proof that Islam is non violent....
    LOOK AT THE WORLD FOR PROOF ISLAM >>IS<< VIOLENT

    This is [4:56] Surely, those who disbelieve in our revelations, we will condemn them to the hellfire. Whenever their skins are burnt, we will give them new skins. Thus, they will suffer continuously. GOD is Almighty, Most Wise. The Bible and the Torah are revelations. ...........
    HOW DOES THE BIBLE AND TORAH BEING REVELATIONS CHANGE THIS ISLAMIC ONE'S INTENT?

    [3:85] Anyone who accepts other than Submission as his religion, it will not be accepted from him, and in the Hereafter, he will be with the losers. Submission to god , jews and christians believe in god. Now we start to see a pattern here, the author is a bigot......
    REALLY? LETS ISSUE A FATWA AND DEATH THREAT ON HIM TOO... LIKE RUSHDIE AND FALWELL

    [3:118] O you who believe, do not befriend outsiders who never cease to wish you harm; they even wish to see you suffer. Hatred flows out of their mouths and what they hide in their chests is far worse. We thus clarify the revelations for you, if you understand. And who in his right mind wants to befriend strangers who want to cause him harm?
    ....
    JUST UNFRIENDLY, NO BIG DEAL COMPARED TO THE DEATH VERSES

    [5:51] O you who believe, do not take certain Jews and Christians as allies; these are allies of one another. Those among you who ally themselves with these belong with them. GOD does not guide the transgressors
    *5:51 Relations with other people are governed by the basic rule in 5:57 & 60:8-9. The Jews and Christians who cannot be friends are specifically mentioned in 5:57; they are the ones who mock and ridicule the believers, or attack them. ...................................
    THE VERSE PITS JEWS AND CHRISTIANS WHO ARE ALLIES "OF ONE ANOTHER" AGAINST ISLAM... BAD READING "reason"

    [4:144] O you who believe, you shall not ally yourselves with the disbelievers, instead of the believers. Do you wish to provide GOD with a clear proof against you? And this is bad because? Dont make allies with non believers instead of the believers, but it dosnt say dont take allies with non-believers!(note the author says friends, which is a lie in the first place) same thing goes for 3:28. ....
    JUST MORE ALIENATING KORAN

    [9:23] O you who believe, do not ally yourselves even with your parents and your siblings, if they prefer disbelieving over believing. Those among you who ally themselves with them are transgressing. This verse is talking to the people at the time of the prophet because[9:20] Those who believe, and emigrate, and strive in the cause of GOD with their money and their lives, are far greater in rank in the sight of GOD. These are the winners. Note the emigrate or higra the time when Mohamed and his followers went to medina to escape prosecution from those Parents and Siblings........
    WE ALL KNOW THE UNFORTUNATE VIOLENT BEGINNINGS OF ISLAM

    [9:123] O you who believe, you shall fight the disbelievers who attack you - let them find you stern - and know that GOD is with the righteous. The verse is self explainatory "who attack you".The author has forsaken any scholastic integrity he might have had when he wrote this article......
    YOU MADE NO VALID CRITICISM IF WARRAQ HERE

    [8:30] The disbelievers plot and scheme to neutralize you, or kill you, or banish you. However, they plot and scheme, but so does GOD. GOD is the best schemer. The verse is for the prophet, and god is a schemer and that is bad why? ......
    THIS VERSE SAYS NONBELIEVERS ARE PLOTTING TO KILL BELIEVERS, ANOTHER HOSTILE PROCLAMATION

    [9:5] Once the Sacred Months are past, (and they refuse to make peace) you may kill the idol worshipers when you encounter them, punish them, and resist every move they make. If they repent and observe the Contact Prayers (Salat) and give the obligatory charity (Zakat), you shall let them go. GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful. How is this bad!!! This is the most tolerance I have seen......,.
    FOR THE KORAN IT ISN'T BAD MAYBE... BUT I'D SAY "KILL THE IDOL WORSHIPPERS" ISN'T GOOD, WOULD YOU?

    [9:28] O you who believe, the idol worshipers are polluted; they shall not be permitted to approach the Sacred Masjid after this year. If you fear loss of income, GOD will shower you with His provisions, in accordance with His will. GOD is Omniscient, Most Wise. And? Muslims believe Idolers have polluted souls and shouldnt come close to their Sacred mosques.....
    GREAT STUFF: 'OTHER PEOPLE, WHO ARE APPARENTLY FILTH, HAVE POLLUTED THEIR SOULS.


    THAT'S IT?

    I'D SAY, IN FACT, WARRAQ'S INTERPRETATION BETTER REFLECTS WHAT ISLAM >IS< DOING TODAY. FROM NORTH AFRICA TO ASIA------- WHERE THERE'S ISLAM, THERE'S WAR.

  9. #39
    reason
    Guest

    Re: Re: Re: Logical Proof, Islam DOES SUPPORT Terrorism

    Originally posted by abu afak
    ................Im gonna try and reply to every single verse this guy quotes. ""

    This is [9:5] Once the Sacred Months are past, (and they refuse to make peace) you may kill the idol worshipers when you encounter them, punish them, and resist every move they make. If they repent and observe the Contact Prayers (Salat) and give the obligatory charity (Zakat), you shall let them go. GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful. So 9:6 is talking about those who refuse to make peace............
    AND WHO MIGHT THAT BE .. JEWS, CHRISTIANS, AND HINDUS, THEY ARE FIGHTING EVERYWHERE ISLAM EXISTS?

    [4:75] Why should you not fight in the cause of GOD when weak men, women, and children are imploring: "Our Lord, deliver us from this community whose people are oppressive, and be You our Lord and Master." So 4:76, 4:74 are taken out of context (funny the author quotes 4:74 and 4:76 but dosnt even mention 4:75!!!) . So the three verses put togther mean, Fight those non believers who are oppresive and fight for tyranny.........
    YOU MEAN EVERYONE THEY THEY WANT TO SAY IS TYRANNICAL... IN FACT TYRANNY IS A SPECIALTY BY ISLAMIC GOVERMENTS TO THEIR MINORITY SUBJECTS

    This is [8:39] You shall fight them to ward off oppression, and to practice your religion devoted to GOD alone. If they refrain from aggression, then GOD is fully Seer of everything they do .So 8:39 -8:42 is talking about those who transgress.Further proof that Islam is non violent....
    LOOK AT THE WORLD FOR PROOF ISLAM >>IS<< VIOLENT

    This is [4:56] Surely, those who disbelieve in our revelations, we will condemn them to the hellfire. Whenever their skins are burnt, we will give them new skins. Thus, they will suffer continuously. GOD is Almighty, Most Wise. The Bible and the Torah are revelations. ...........
    HOW DOES THE BIBLE AND TORAH BEING REVELATIONS CHANGE THIS ISLAMIC ONE'S INTENT?

    [3:85] Anyone who accepts other than Submission as his religion, it will not be accepted from him, and in the Hereafter, he will be with the losers. Submission to god , jews and christians believe in god. Now we start to see a pattern here, the author is a bigot......
    REALLY? LETS ISSUE A FATWA AND DEATH THREAT ON HIM TOO... LIKE RUSHDIE AND FALWELL

    [3:118] O you who believe, do not befriend outsiders who never cease to wish you harm; they even wish to see you suffer. Hatred flows out of their mouths and what they hide in their chests is far worse. We thus clarify the revelations for you, if you understand. And who in his right mind wants to befriend strangers who want to cause him harm?
    ....
    JUST UNFRIENDLY, NO BIG DEAL COMPARED TO THE DEATH VERSES

    [5:51] O you who believe, do not take certain Jews and Christians as allies; these are allies of one another. Those among you who ally themselves with these belong with them. GOD does not guide the transgressors
    *5:51 Relations with other people are governed by the basic rule in 5:57 & 60:8-9. The Jews and Christians who cannot be friends are specifically mentioned in 5:57; they are the ones who mock and ridicule the believers, or attack them. ...................................
    THE VERSE PITS JEWS AND CHRISTIANS WHO ARE ALLIES "OF ONE ANOTHER" AGAINST ISLAM... BAD READING "reason"

    [4:144] O you who believe, you shall not ally yourselves with the disbelievers, instead of the believers. Do you wish to provide GOD with a clear proof against you? And this is bad because? Dont make allies with non believers instead of the believers, but it dosnt say dont take allies with non-believers!(note the author says friends, which is a lie in the first place) same thing goes for 3:28. ....
    JUST MORE ALIENATING KORAN

    [9:23] O you who believe, do not ally yourselves even with your parents and your siblings, if they prefer disbelieving over believing. Those among you who ally themselves with them are transgressing. This verse is talking to the people at the time of the prophet because[9:20] Those who believe, and emigrate, and strive in the cause of GOD with their money and their lives, are far greater in rank in the sight of GOD. These are the winners. Note the emigrate or higra the time when Mohamed and his followers went to medina to escape prosecution from those Parents and Siblings........
    WE ALL KNOW THE UNFORTUNATE VIOLENT BEGINNINGS OF ISLAM

    [9:123] O you who believe, you shall fight the disbelievers who attack you - let them find you stern - and know that GOD is with the righteous. The verse is self explainatory "who attack you".The author has forsaken any scholastic integrity he might have had when he wrote this article......
    YOU MADE NO VALID CRITICISM IF WARRAQ HERE

    [8:30] The disbelievers plot and scheme to neutralize you, or kill you, or banish you. However, they plot and scheme, but so does GOD. GOD is the best schemer. The verse is for the prophet, and god is a schemer and that is bad why? ......
    THIS VERSE SAYS NONBELIEVERS ARE PLOTTING TO KILL BELIEVERS, ANOTHER HOSTILE PROCLAMATION

    [9:5] Once the Sacred Months are past, (and they refuse to make peace) you may kill the idol worshipers when you encounter them, punish them, and resist every move they make. If they repent and observe the Contact Prayers (Salat) and give the obligatory charity (Zakat), you shall let them go. GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful. How is this bad!!! This is the most tolerance I have seen......,.
    FOR THE KORAN IT ISN'T BAD MAYBE... BUT I'D SAY "KILL THE IDOL WORSHIPPERS" ISN'T GOOD, WOULD YOU?

    [9:28] O you who believe, the idol worshipers are polluted; they shall not be permitted to approach the Sacred Masjid after this year. If you fear loss of income, GOD will shower you with His provisions, in accordance with His will. GOD is Omniscient, Most Wise. And? Muslims believe Idolers have polluted souls and shouldnt come close to their Sacred mosques.....
    GREAT STUFF: 'OTHER PEOPLE, WHO ARE APPARENTLY FILTH, HAVE POLLUTED THEIR SOULS.


    THAT'S IT?

    I'D SAY, IN FACT, WARRAQ'S INTERPRETATION BETTER REFLECTS WHAT ISLAM >IS< DOING TODAY. FROM NORTH AFRICA TO ASIA------- WHERE THERE'S ISLAM, THERE'S WAR.

    In all your post not in one instance have you refuted my claim that Islam is a peaceful religion all you did was try and prove that muslims are violent. You wrote this "I'D SAY, IN FACT, WARRAQ'S INTERPRETATION BETTER REFLECTS WHAT ISLAM >IS< DOING TODAY" notice that you added TODAY so you must agree that Islam wasnt always like that, thus it is enough to say that you also agree that Islam as a religion is not violent.

  10. #40
    abu afak
    Guest

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Logical Proof, Islam DOES SUPPORT Terrorism

    Originally posted by reason
    In all your post not in one instance have you refuted my claim that Islam is a peaceful religion all you did was try and prove that muslims are violent. You wrote this "I'D SAY, IN FACT, WARRAQ'S INTERPRETATION BETTER REFLECTS WHAT ISLAM >IS< DOING TODAY" notice that you added TODAY so you must agree that Islam wasnt always like that, thus it is enough to say that you also agree that Islam as a religion is not violent.
    Yes, it wasn't always like that... It was often WORSE... like the first 100 years, for Instance.
    Last edited by abu afak; 11-18-2002 at 09:00 AM.

  11. #41
    reason
    Guest

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Logical Proof, Islam DOES SUPPORT Terrorism

    Originally posted by abu afak
    Yes, it wasn't always like that... It was often WORSE... like the first 100 years, for Instance.
    Islam is a peaceful religion whether you believe it or not. I provided the interpretations of these verses, and you have not refuted them, and tried to blame Muslims faults on Islam.All you try to do is show that the verses are incorrect because some Muslims chose not to follow them.

  12. #42
    abu afak
    Guest

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Logical Proof, Islam DOES SUPPORT Terrorism

    Originally posted by reason
    Islam is a peaceful religion whether you believe it or not. I provided the interpretations of these verses, and you have not refuted them, and tried to blame Muslims faults on Islam.All you try to do is show that the verses are incorrect because some Muslims chose not to follow them.
    I did refute and I also refuted your premise that now isn't the only time Islam was Extremely Violent (ie the first 100 years even more so)

  13. #43
    cerulean
    Guest

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Logical Proof, Islam DOES SUPPORT Terrorism

    Interesting article at The New Republic. There is a free registration required to see it.
    http://www.tnr.com/doc.mhtml?i=20021118&s=foer111802

    THE LIFE OF A LIBERAL MUSLIM.
    Moral Hazard
    by Franklin Foer
    Post date: 11.12.02
    Issue date: 11.18.02

    The death threats began shortly after September 11, 2001. Every few days, for about four months, Khaled Abou El Fadl would receive an angry, anonymous phone call at either his San Fernando Valley home or his UCLA office. In his e-mail inbox, he found ominous messages from obscured sources with warnings such as, "You know what we're capable of." At first, the pudgy, 39-year-old professor of Islamic jurisprudence dismissed the calls as harmless outbursts at a tense moment. But, as the fall of 2001 progressed, Abou El Fadl began suspecting that the threats were more serious than he had initially assumed. Twice in November, he noticed a van that inexplicably lingered outside of his relatively isolated home but then disappeared after he called the police. A few months later, he found the windows of his family's SUV smashed at a crowded movie theater parking lot. Neither the radio nor the cash in the car had been stolen; no other vehicle in the lot had been touched.

    When he brought these incidents to the attention of police, they requested--and he granted--permission to tap his home phone. UCLA installed a red panic button next to his desk, ensuring that campus cops could respond within minutes to any crisis in his office. The FBI even assigned an agent to track down his tormenters. (To date, they have not been found.) All of this might sound like the prelude to a textbook hate crime, but the Abou El Fadl case has a twist: The callers weren't angry white men accusing him of terrorist sympathies; they were fellow Muslim Americans accusing him of selling out the faith.

    On September 14, 2001, Abou El Fadl had published an op-ed in the Los Angeles Times. Many Muslim Americans had condemned the week's attacks as un-Islamic. But Abou El Fadl felt this response amounted to an evasion. The attacks, he worried, didn't represent a deviation from mainstream Islam; they reflected a crisis at the core of the faith, the logical conclusion of "a puritanical and ethically oblivious form of Islam [that] has predominated since the 1970s." Centuries of Islamic intellectual development had been destroyed by the "rampant apologetics" of Muslim thinkers, which had "produced a culture that eschews self-critical and introspective insight and embraces projection of blame and a fantasy-like level of confidence and arrogance."
    ...

  14. #44
    reason
    Guest

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Logical Proof, Islam DOES SUPPORT Terrorism

    Originally posted by abu afak
    I did refute and I also refuted your premise that now isn't the only time Islam was Extremely Violent (ie the first 100 years even more so)
    You didnt refute anything. You just stated your unfounded ignorant opinion on why these verses are incorrect because some muslims refuse to abide by them. You dont seem to have anything further to add, so I will be ignoring you until you come up with something more logical.

  15. #45
    abu afak
    Guest

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Logical Proof, Islam DOES SUPPORT Terrorism

    Originally posted by reason
    You didnt refute anything. You just stated your unfounded ignorant opinion on why these verses are incorrect because some muslims refuse to abide by them. You dont seem to have anything further to add, so I will be ignoring you until you come up with something more logical.
    I refuted what was your mere opinion/Apologist-view with mine... As to whose is right??? I again ask you to look at the world today..

    Where there is Islam there is War. .. no getting around it.

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