Iraqi resistance against aggressors

**NewsGuy** · 03-25-2003, 01:15 PM

Originally posted by takeo
How funny that you want to liberate the iraqi people but support the oppression and etnic cleansing of the palestinians by a foreign army.
if this is the kind of "liberation" you are planning in iraq as well, some serious trouble is waiting you.

Interesting point. Actually, I very much hope that we treat other brutal, terrorism supporting Arab and Islamic dictatorships in the same way we treat Iraq and Saddam Hussein.

There really is no difference between our Iraqi enemies and our Palestinian enemies. In fact, the Palestinians have been rejoicing at American casualties and POWs, and they are waving Saddam photos while burning American flags in Gaza, under the direct supervision of Yasser Arafat.

Arab and Islamic dictatorships like Iraq, Syria, the Palestinian entity and Iran must be eradicated for the world to be able to live in peace.

Iraq is a good first step in a new Middle East initiative. But to provide a fair and balanced approach, we must now deal with other monsters like Yasser Arafat, the Iranian Ayatollahs, Sheik Yassin, Sheik Nasrallah and Baby Assad. One they are gone, the people of the Middle East -- and of the entire world -- will breath much easier. And the time to do it is right now while we have 300,000 troops stationed there.

cerulean · 03-25-2003, 01:24 PM

As has been posted many times elsewhere on the forum, Iraq provides money to Palestinian suicide bombers' families and other funding. (Of course it's not the only Arab state to do so.) Palestinian and al Qaeda terrorists have sought refuge in Iraq.

I hate the fact that US, UK, and Australian troops have to suffer as much as they are, to do something that will be of benefit to anyone of any citizenship seeking a terrorism-free existence. The remaining question is: what benefits is the US gaining from having troops in Europe right now? Would it be of more benefit to redeploy them? I'm not saying they all should go into Iraq, but it's got to be a drain on resources to have so many troops in Europe.

takeo · 03-26-2003, 03:02 AM

Two more us-war-crimes today:
a market has been bombed, 17 civilian casualties
the us starts to target civilian buildings: the television and university building have been hit!

Interesting point. Actually, I very much hope that we treat other brutal, terrorism supporting Arab and Islamic dictatorships in the same way we treat Iraq and Saddam Hussein.

All right, let's start with saoudi arabia, kouweit, Jordan, and of course Turkey.
Or do you mean anti-american and anti-israel brutal dictatorships only? I'm sorry for the confusion, you didn't made any specification...

There really is no difference between our Iraqi enemies and our Palestinian enemies. In fact, the Palestinians have been rejoicing at American casualties and POWs, and they are waving Saddam photos while burning American flags in Gaza, under the direct supervision of Yasser Arafat.

Indeed, both the palestinian and iraqi people resist colonialist oppression and occupation by a foreign power.
Burning American flags and wearing saddam pictures, wow, isn't this the worst war-crime possible? Let's crush them!!!

Arab and Islamic dictatorships like Iraq, Syria, the Palestinian entity and Iran must be eradicated for the world to be able to live in peace.

And in the meanwhile their peoples too(transfers...), after all they're nothing but terrorist supporting arabs/muslims. there 's only one problem, how are you going to install democracy without a people?
of course it was iraq attacking the us, right? so in order to live in peace we must destroy iraq... right?

Iraq is a good first step in a new Middle East initiative. But to provide a fair and balanced approach, we must now deal with other monsters like Yasser Arafat, the Iranian Ayatollahs, Sheik Yassin, Sheik Nasrallah and Baby Assad. One they are gone, the people of the Middle East -- and of the entire world -- will breath much easier. And the time to do it is right now while we have 300,000 troops stationed there.

Yep for sure the palestinians will breathe much easier once liberated from the evil oppression of arafat by the glorious IDF, saver of the palestinian people...

So you're also planning to attack Syria and Iran. well it wouldn't surprise me, the only question is, what new excuse will Bush find to do so?
Also don't forget that the cost to extend this war to the whole middle east will be tremendous, and noone will help you. And you'll have to occupy this countries for a long time, and don't forget that iran signed some defense agreements with Russia...

the us can barely win against iraq, so a war against Syria and Iran will be even more difficult. The whole world is already furious and i wouldn't like to imagine the reactions to such crimes.
it will be the recolonisation of the arab world, and a giant intifadeh as a consequence.

Hey but why do all those people hate the us????

cerulean, everyone is pretty much convinced that the current aggression against an arab country will only enhance terrorism, and the Arabs have today a very legitimate reason to attack the us ( political and military targets), American soldiers are fighting for the geo-political controll over the middle east.

palestinian and al-quaida terrorists have sought refuge in a lot of countries around the world (by the way al-quaida only in territory not controlled by saddam), are you planning to invade all those countries as well?

Many cuban and vietnamese terrorists have sought refuge in the us, so in your eyes those countries have a legitimate reason to attack the us, right?

People attacking the us and israel is terrorism right? While the us and israel have the right to attack anywhere anytime, right and it'll be legitimate self-defense?
But you're wrong, self-defense is not compatible with pre-emptive strikes, and terrorism means attacking civilian targets.

But i agree on one thing: the us should withdraw its troops from Europe. And we should stop granting the us military privileges while ignoring our own defense-system.

takeo · 03-26-2003, 03:21 AM

another lie made in Washington and London: the only foreign observer and journalist in basra, the correspondent for al-jazeera, didn't notice any sign of resurrection among the population, at least not against the iraqi armed forces.

another fantasy: iraq will use chemical weapons once th" red line" will be crossed. this one will be easy to verify, let's see who's lying...

JustPat · 03-26-2003, 08:12 AM

takeo:
I'm so glad you are not biased in any way!

Originally posted by takeo
Two more us-war-crimes today:
a market has been bombed, 17 civilian casualties
the us starts to target civilian buildings: the television and university building have been hit!

1. In order for civilian casualties to be war crimes they have to be intentionally targeted. When you can present evidence of that we will listen. Until then you are acting as a propaganda spouting Iraqi.
2. Iraqi TV, Saddam TV, the propaganda machine used to broadcast violations of the Geneva Convention and to extend Saddam's terror influence. Sorry for your loss ... NOT!
3. Universities, hospitals, or any other facility used to house the Iraqi war machine are acceptable military targets. Blame Saddam, not the US.

Originally posted by takeo
All right, let's start with saoudi arabia, kouweit, Jordan, and of course Turkey. Or do you mean anti-american and anti-israel brutal dictatorships only? I'm sorry for the confusion, you didn't made any specification...

One thing at a time, or two, or three ...

Originally posted by takeo
Blah, blah, blah ... rant, rant, rant

Ignore, ignore, ignore.

Originally posted by takeo
But i agree on one thing: the us should withdraw its troops from Europe. And we should stop granting the us military privileges while ignoring our own defense-system.

OK, from here on out, France is on its own, surrender to anyone you want.

Originally posted by takeo
another lie made in Washington and London: the only foreign observer and journalist in basra, the correspondent for al-jazeera, didn't notice any sign of resurrection among the population, at least not against the iraqi armed forces.

Really now, al Jazeera as a source for truth, you have got to be kidding. Why would you cite them when they have already proven to be a) thouroughly biased in favor of Iraq, and b) complicit in the Iraqi war crimes?

Originally posted by takeo
another fantasy: iraq will use chemical weapons once th" red line" will be crossed. this one will be easy to verify, let's see who's lying...

Yes, let's.

MichaelC · 03-26-2003, 08:33 AM

Originally posted by takeo
another lie made in Washington and London: the only foreign observer and journalist in basra, the correspondent for al-jazeera, didn't notice any sign of resurrection among the population, at least not against the iraqi armed forces.

I had to "leap" on this statement before you got the chance to alter your wording as it is just one of those great "slips of the tongue" that may provide some entertainment on the way.

If they could, my heart tells me that those who have been tortured and murdered by saddam and his henchmen would indeed "resurrect" from the dead to exact their revenge. Some 50,000 pissed off Shiite dead, returned from the grave to take care of business. Now THAT I would like to see!

another fantasy: iraq will use chemical weapons once th" red line" will be crossed. this one will be easy to verify, let's see who's lying...

In keeping with your "newfound" commitment to the truth, should the reverse of your speculation be the outcome, may we expect YOUR return to this thread to admit your own spreading of lies?

**Mediocrates** · 03-26-2003, 08:34 AM

As an aside I'd remind the denizens of Eurostan that roughly 55% of all industrial and academic R+D is done in the US. Don't be so quick to show us your butts. You might need that new drug or catheter or electronic widget. Just a thought.

cerulean · 03-26-2003, 08:59 AM

Takeo, did you see this first-hand account by a would-be human shield?

http://sf.indymedia.org/news/2003/03/1590685/php

He found the Iraqi people did not want him there, and they wanted Saddam gone.

takeo · 03-26-2003, 01:47 PM

cerulean,

I doubt this is a real report. and if you take a look on indymendia you'll lots of totally different reports.
I've been to iraq as well, and many people think saddam is a thug and thief (altough other people staunchly defend the regime), but very few have anything positive to say about the us, I didn't meet a single iraqi inside iraq who approoved us-policy in the last 12 years. This is confirmed by the hostile reaction us-soldiers receive in "liberated" areas.

medio, what i propose is a military and political divorse, not an economic one.

I'm so glad you are not biased in any way!

I am, but so are you.

1. In order for civilian casualties to be war crimes they have to be intentionally targeted. When you can present evidence of that we will listen. Until then you are acting as a propaganda spouting Iraqi.
2. Iraqi TV, Saddam TV, the propaganda machine used to broadcast violations of the Geneva Convention and to extend Saddam's terror influence. Sorry for your loss ... NOT!
3. Universities, hospitals, or any other facility used to house the Iraqi war machine are acceptable military targets. Blame Saddam, not the US.

1. the us didn't need any evidence to present all civilian death of civilians in the yugoslavian crisis as intentionally...
2. tV-stations are ALWAYS a source of propaganda, in the us at well, or do you think us-channels aren't biased? Would you agree if someone blew up the offices of fox television or CNN? Still bombing them is forbidden by the geneva)conventions, quite a more serious breach than iraqi showing POW on television, unharmed.
3. no, they're not. in yugoslavia people have been convicted exactly for bombing universities and hospitals.

again another case of, "justice for you but not for me"

One thing at a time, or two, or three ...

No, the us will never depose it's Arab friendly dictators. on the contrary, if there would be democratic elections right away in all Arab and middle Eastern countries, the us could pretty much forget to keep one single ally or influence in the region, and should rEALLY have something to worry about.
for example in jordan the king and government is more or less pro-us while the population is heavily and violently anti-american, according to all reporters, even CNN.

OK, from here on out, France is on its own, surrender to anyone you want.

France is already on its own, but hopefully germany and other European countries will join us to form an independant European force.

Really now, al Jazeera as a source for truth, you have got to be kidding. Why would you cite them when they have already proven to be a) thouroughly biased in favor of Iraq, and b) complicit in the Iraqi war crimes?

al -jazeera is based in a us-ally, its staff are mostly young independant and progressive women and men, and they are the only channel that reports about everything, independant of government-propaganda. They are the only Arab channel to report about casualties of suicide-bombings in israel as well.
They are certainly a lot less biased than CNN and other us-channels, who only broadcast what is permitted by the us-military commanders, and do not even have correspondants in iraqi cities.
Would you rather believe a military commander of the occupying force or an observer in the city?

In keeping with your "newfound" commitment to the truth, should the reverse of your speculation be the outcome, may we expect YOUR return to this thread to admit your own spreading of lies?

yes, ok, on one condition: that if my speculation prooves to be real, YOU will admit you're wrong and bush was lying all the way...

cerulean · 03-26-2003, 01:55 PM

Takeo, the article first appeared in the London Telegraph and was also reprinted in the Jerusalem Post (I know you would use the latter against it).

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/m...3/23/ixop.html

takeo · 03-26-2003, 03:23 PM

more news: 100's of iraqi gathered to receive aid in a conquered city near the border with kouweit shouted "long live Saddam, death to Bush" and spit in the fact of us-occupying forces, strangely enough those images haven't been distributed on American channels...

Another important news: the Iraqi shiite opposition leader in iran, the one who organised the 1991 revolt and very popular among the southern iraqi who dislike Saddam, declared today that Americans have to leave the moment Saddam has disappeared, if not they would launch an intifadeh against the new occupier. "no Saddam, no US either"...

some interesting times ahead for us-occupiers...

**Mediocrates** · 03-26-2003, 05:04 PM

Originally posted by takeo
medio, what i propose is a military and political divorse, not an economic one.

Me too - it's just that most technology is shared on this level. I'd like to see an academic banning of all Europeans from US publically funded research and a complete end to all sharing of all military technology. We already have laws banning tech transfer to certain nations - all we have to do is expand the list.

MichaelC · 03-26-2003, 05:11 PM

Originally posted by takeo
more news: 100's of iraqi gathered to receive aid in a conquered city near the border with kouweit shouted "long live Saddam, death to Bush" and spit in the fact of us-occupying forces, strangely enough those images haven't been distributed on American channels...

Another important news: the Iraqi shiite opposition leader in iran, the one who organised the 1991 revolt and very popular among the southern iraqi who dislike Saddam, declared today that Americans have to leave the moment Saddam has disappeared, if not they would launch an intifadeh against the new occupier. "no Saddam, no US either"...

some interesting times ahead for us-occupiers...

It has always been your style to make up things and post them here as actual fact. Why is that you think you can do that?

JustPat · 03-26-2003, 08:18 PM

Originally posted by takeo
more news: 100's of iraqi gathered to receive aid in a conquered city near the border with kouweit shouted "long live Saddam, death to Bush" and spit in the fact of us-occupying forces, strangely enough those images haven't been distributed on American channels...

Obviously you are not watching Fox News or you would not have made such an asinine statement. Three cheers fo rfair and balanced.

Originally posted by takeo
Another important news: the Iraqi shiite opposition leader in iran, the one who organised the 1991 revolt and very popular among the southern iraqi who dislike Saddam, declared today that Americans have to leave the moment Saddam has disappeared, if not they would launch an intifadeh against the new occupier. "no Saddam, no US either"...

some interesting times ahead for us-occupiers...

So why are you not decrying the atrocities of the Iraqi forces? What hatred you have for those you don't even know. How sad to be you.

MichaelC · 03-26-2003, 09:40 PM

Originally posted by JustPat
Obviously you are not watching Fox News or you would not have made such an asinine statement. Three cheers fo rfair and balanced.

So why are you not decrying the atrocities of the Iraqi forces? What hatred you have for those you don't even know. How sad to be you.

Both 60MinutesII and cable MSNBC had programs tonight that included extensive footage of hundreds of joyous people, mingling with the troops who'd liberated their area.

Not at trace of fear or even wariness in them, only happiness. Apparently al jazeerah does not show these sorts of events on their broadcasts, so takeo is only capable of half an opinion.