BIBLE & HISTORY SOURCES: Holy Temple, Jerusalem,Land of Israel, Arab Palestinians

[Batman]

THE LAND OF ISRAEL
Now the Lord had said to Abram: "Get out of your country, from your family and from your father's house, to a land that I will show you. Gen 12.1

So Abram departed as the Lord had spoken to him... So they came to the land of Canaan. Gen 12.4a, 12.5d
On the same day the Lord made a covenant with Abram, saying: "To your descendants I have given this land, from the river of Egypt (the Wadi el Arish) to the great river, the River Euphrates" Gen 15.18

God told Isaac...) "Dwell in this land (Canaan), and I will be with you and bless you; for to you and your descendants I give all these lands, and I will perform the oath which I swore to Abraham your father." Gen 26.3

God told Jacob...) "I am the Lord God of Abraham your father and the God of Isaac; the land on which you lie I will give to you and your descendants. Gen 28.13b

And the Lord said (to Moses): "I have surely seen the oppression of My people who are in Egypt, and have heard their cry because of their taskmasters, for I know their sorrows. So I have come down to deliver them out of the hand of the Egyptians, and to bring them up from that land to a good and large land, to a land flowing with milk and honey, to the place of the Canaanites and the Hittites and the Amorites and the Perizzites and the Hivites and the Jebusites. Exod 3.7-8

Then the Lord spoke to Moses, saying, "Command the children of Israel, and say to them: `When you come into the land of Canaan, this is the land that shall fall to you as an inheritance -- the land of Canaan to its boundaries.' " Num 34.1-2


THE BOUNDARIES OF ISRAEL ACCORDING TO THE BIBLE AS COMMANDED BY GOD

12 TRIBES OF ISRAEL MAP

The Kingdom of David and Solomon 1000 BCE

MUCH MORE INFO:
HISTORY OF ISRAEL IN MAPS GO TO:
Biblical and Ancient History
General


Your southern border shall be from the Wilderness of Zin along the border of Edom; then your southern border shall extend eastward to the end of the Salt Sea. Your border shall turn from the southern side of the Ascent of Akrabbim, continue to Zin, and be on the south of Kadesh Barnea; then it shall go on to Hazar Addar, and continue to Azmon. The border shall turn from Azmon to the Brook of Egypt, and it shall end at the Sea. Num 34.3-5

MEANS:The Southern border of the Promised Land (Canaan) runs from the southern end of the Dead Sea (Salt Sea), to approximately the middle of the Negev desert. From there, it turns Northward toward Wadi el Arish (brook of Egypt) and ends at the Mediterranean Sea.

As for the western border, you shall have the Great Sea for a border; this shall be your western border. Num 34.6
MEANS:The Western border of the Promised Land (Canaan) is the Mediterranean Sea (Great Sea).

And this shall be your northern border: From the Great Sea you shall mark out your border line to Mount Hor. From Mount Hor you shall mark out your border to the entrance of Hamath. Then the direction of the border shall be toward Zedad. The border shall proceed to Ziphron, and it shall end at Hazar Enan. This shall be your northern border. Num 34.7-9

MEANS:The Northern border of the Promised Land (Canaan) extends from the Northern region of Lebanon at the Mediterranean Sea, to a region east of Damascus in modern day Syria.

You shall mark out your eastern border from Hazar Enan to Shepham. The border shall go down from Shepham to Riblah on the east side of Ain. The border shall go down and reach to the eastern side of the Sea of Chinnereth. The border shall go down along the Jordan, and it shall end at the Salt Sea. This shall be your land with its surrounding boundaries. Num 34.10-12

MEANS:The Eastern border of the Promised Land (Canaan) goes southward for about 50 miles, starting from a region east of Damascus. Then it turns West to the Southern end of the Sea of Galilee (Sea of Chinnereth). From there it follows the Jordan River, ending at the Dead Sea (Salt Sea).

The earth is the Lord's, and all its fullness, The world and those who dwell therein. Psalm 24.1

(God commanded Israel...) "The land shall not be sold permanently, for the land is Mine; for you are strangers and sojourners with Me." Lev 25.23

MEANS:These verses make it clear that God has the right to give land to whomever He wishes.

The Bible carefully states that God has given Canaan to Israel, and carefully defines the borders of that land.

By God's decree, the land of Canaan belongs to Israel, even though Israel does not now reside in the totality of it.

God forbids Israel to give up any portion of the land He gave them.



Palestinian ARABS have NOTHING to do with the Philistines of the BIBLE: Palestinian ARABS are simply ARABS. The sons of Ham were Cush, Mizraim, Put, and Canaan. Mizraim begot Ludim, Anamim, Lehabim, Naphtuhim, Pathrusim, and Casluhim (from whom came the Philistines and Caphtorim). Gen 10.6, 10.13-14

The Philistines were a non-Semitic people (neither Arab nor Jew) descended from Ham's son Mizraim. They invaded Israel from either Crete or Egypt.


Accordingly, "Palestinians" are Arabs who occupied Canaan AFTER Rome kicked out the Jews.

ISRAEL IS RENAMED PALESTINE BY THE ROMANS WHO DESTROYED THE JEWISH TEMPLE ON TEMPLE MOUNT AND EXILED THE REMAINING JEWS

The Lord's prophesy was fulfilled in 70 AD. The Romans not only destroyed the Temple, but they also kicked the Jews out of Israel.

The Romans then renamed Israel as "Palestine."

The Romans derived the name, "Palestine," from "Philistines," a people conquered by the Jews centuries earlier.
The Philistines were a non-Semitic people (neither Arab nor Jew) descended from Ham's son Mizraim. They invaded Israel from either Crete or Egypt.


THE TEMPLE:
http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/Jud...he_Temple.html

The Temple Mount in Jerusalem

"As the navel is set in the centre of the human body,
so is the land of Israel the navel of the world...
situated in the centre of the world,
and Jerusalem in the centre of the land of Israel,
and the sanctuary in the centre of Jerusalem,
and the holy place in the centre of the sanctuary,
and the ark in the centre of the holy place,
and the foundation stone before the holy place,
because from it the world was founded."
Midrash Tanchuma,, Qedoshim

Temple Models

JERUSALEM

JERUSALEM FACTS AND MYTHS

Whose is JERUSALEM ?
(SOME OF THE FACTS-SEE MORE IN LINK ABOVE)
For over 3,300 years, Jerusalem has been the Jewish capital. Jerusalem has never been the capital of any Arab or Muslim entity. Even when the Jordanians occupied Jerusalem, they never sought to make it their capital, and Arab leaders did not come to visit.

Jerusalem is mentioned over 700 times in Tanach, the Jewish Holy Scriptures. Jerusalem is not mentioned once in the Koran.

King David founded the city of Jerusalem ( in 1000 B.C.) Mohammed (Who founded Islam in 600AD) never came to Jerusalem.

Jews pray facing Jerusalem. Muslims pray with their backs toward Jerusalem.


If I forget thee, O Jerusalem,
Let my right hand forget her cunning.
Let my tongue cleave to the roof of my mouth,
If I remember thee not;
If I set not Jerusalem Above my chiefest joy.


"PRAY FOR THE PEACE OF JERUSALEM"
PSALM 122:6


Could I but kiss thy dust
so would I feign expire.
As sweet as honey then,
my longing and desire.
Yehuda Halevi
Spanish-Hebrew poet
(c. 1075-1141)

Approximately three thousand years ago, King David conquered the city of Jerusalem from the Jebusites, and claimed it his capital. Here, Solomon, David's successor built the First Temple, making Jerusalem the spiritual center of the Jewish people. Jews were barred from the city for nearly six centuries beginning with the exile to Babylon in 586 BCE*, after the destruction of the Second Temple by the Roman, Titus in 70 CE**, and again by the Christians during the period of the Crusaders in the 12th century. While in exile the Jews longed for their Jerusalem.

* BCE stands for "Before Common Era," also referred to as BC or "Before Christ."
** CE stands for "Common Era," also referred to AD or "Anno Domini."

FROM:Jerusalem and Judaism

Timeline: History of Jerusalem
UNITED JERUSALEM

CURRENT/RECENT ISRAEL HISTORY:

In 1946 a very small part of the Promised Land (Canaan) was returned to the Jews, and became known as Israel.

In the Six-Day War in 1967, Israel captured Judea, Samaria and East Jerusalem.
Israel captured those areas from Jordan, NOT from a nation known as Palestine.
In fact, Palestine has never existed as an autonomous people or nation.
Accordingly, "Palestinians" are Arabs who occupied Canaan AFTER Rome kicked out the Jews.


Also see:http://www.biblebell.org/mbag/mailbagaj.htmlTRIBES OF ISRAEL

[Batman]

FUTURE PROPHECIES AND SOME WHICH HAVE ALREADY MATERIALIZED IN OUR DAYS:


Zechariah 14:1
1 Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.

2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle;

3 Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.

4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

6 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the light shall not be clear, nor dark:

7 But it shall be one day which shall be known to the LORD, not day, nor night: but it shall come to pass, that at evening time it shall be light.

8 And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer and in winter shall it be.
9 And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and his name one.

10 All the land shall be turned as a plain from Geba to Rimmon south of Jerusalem: and it shall be lifted up, and inhabited in her place, from Benjamin's gate unto the place of the first gate, unto the corner gate, and from the tower of Hananeel unto the king's winepresses.

11 And men shall dwell in it, and there shall be no more utter destruction; but Jerusalem shall be safely inhabited.

12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the LORD will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

13 And it shall come to pass in that day, that a great tumult from the LORD shall be among them; and they shall lay hold every one on the hand of his neighbour, and his hand shall rise up against the hand of his neighbour.

14 And Judah also shall fight at Jerusalem; and the wealth of all the heathen round about shall be gathered together, gold, and silver, and apparel, in great abundance.

15 And so shall be the plague of the horse, of the mule, of the camel, and of the ass, and of all the beasts that shall be in these tents, as this plague.

16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.

17 And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain.

18 And if the family of Egypt go not up, and come not, that have no rain; there shall be the plague, wherewith the LORD will smite the heathen that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.

19 This shall be the punishment of Egypt, and the punishment of all nations that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.
20 In that day shall there be upon the bells of the horses, HOLINESS UNTO THE LORD; and the pots in the LORD'S house shall be like the bowls before the altar.

21 Yea, every pot in Jerusalem and in Judah shall be holiness unto the LORD of hosts: and all they that sacrifice shall come and take of them, and seethe therein: and in that day there shall be no more the Canaanite in the house of the LORD of hosts



Now it shall come to pass in the latter days that the mountain of the LORD'S house shall be established on the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and peoples shall flow to it. Many nations shall come and say, "Come, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the house of the God of Jacob; he will teach us His ways, and we shall walk in His paths." For out of Zion the law shall go forth, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem. He shall judge between many peoples, and rebuke strong nations afar off; they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruning hooks; nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more. But everyone shall sit under his vine and under his fig tree, and no one shall make them afraid; for the mouth of the LORD of hosts has spoken. (Micah 4:1-4)


Therefore prophecy concerning the land of Israel, and say to the mountains, the hills, the rivers, and the valleys, Thus says the Lord GOD: "Behold, I have spoken in My jealousy and My fury, because you have borne the shame of the nations." Therefore thus says the Lord GOD: "I have raised My hand in an oath that surely the nations that are around you shall bear their own shame. But you, O mountains of Israel, you shall shoot forth your branches and yield your fruit to My people Israel, for they are about to come.

For indeed I am for you, and I will turn to you, and you shall be tilled and sown. I will multiply men upon you, all the house of Israel, all of it; and the cities shall be inhabited and the ruins rebuilt. I will multiply upon you man and beast; and they shall increase and bear young; I will make you inhabited as in former times, and do better for you than at your beginnings. Then you shall know that I am the LORD. Yes, I will cause men to walk on you, My people Israel; they shall take possession of you, and you shall be their inheritance…

"For I will take you from among the nations, gather you out of all countries, and bring you into your own land." (Ezekiel 36: 6-12,24)



"Fear not, for I am with you; I will bring your descendants from the east, and gather you from the west; I will say to the north, 'Give them up!' And to the south, 'Do not keep them back!' Bring My sons from afar, and My daughters from the ends of the earth-Everyone who is called by My name, whom I have created for My glory; I have formed him, yes, I have made him." (Isaiah 43:5-7)

Thus says the LORD who made you and formed you from the womb, who will help you: 'Fear not, O Jacob My servant; and you, Jeshurun, whom I have chosen. For I will pour water on him who is thirsty, and floods on the dry ground; I will pour My Spirit on your descendants, and My blessing on your offspring; One will say, 'I am the LORD'S'; another will call himself by the name of Jacob; another will write with his hand, 'The LORD'S', and name himself by the name of Israel. (Isaiah 44:2-3,5)



Therefore the LORD will wait, that He may be gracious to you; and therefore He will be exalted, that He may have mercy on you. For the LORD is a God of justice; blessed are all those who wait for Him. For the people shall dwell in Zion at Jerusalem; you shall weep no more. He will be very gracious to you at the sound of your cry; when He hears it, He will answer you. (Isaiah 30:18-19)



Moreover the light of the moon will be as the light of the sun, and the light of the sun will be sevenfold, as the light of seven days, IN THE DAY THAT THE LORD BINDS UP THE BRUISE OF HIS PEOPLE AND HEALS THE STROKE OF THEIR WOUND. (Isaiah 30:26)


Sing, O heavens, for the LORD has done it! Shout, you lower parts of the earth; break forth into singing, you mountains, O forest, and every tree in it! For the LORD has redeemed Jacob, AND GLORIFIED HIMSELF IN ISRAEL. (Isaiah 44:23)

"Even if you have been banished to the most distant land under the heavens, from there the LORD your God will gather you and bring you back. He will bring you to the land that belonged to your fathers, and you will take possession of it. He will make you more prosperous and numerous than your fathers." (Deuteronomy 30:4-5 NIV)


The LORD will have compassion on Jacob; once again he will choose Israel and will settle them in their own land. Aliens will join them and unite with the house of Jacob. Nations will take them and bring them to their own place. And the house of Israel will possess the nations as menservants and maidservants in the Lord's land. They will make captives of their captors and rule over their oppressors. (Isaiah 14:1-2 NIV)

[Isiah 2:4]

I agree that there is a lot of Religious elements which affirm or peoples longing to return to our homelands. However...

Mohammed (Who founded Islam in 600AD) never came to Jerusalem.

Er...what is the Dome of The Rock all about then?

Muslims pray with their backs toward Jerusalem.

Well. They pray toward Mecca actually. So if you are a Muslim in Europe or America or Africa or Asia you will be praying toward the Middle East. And with your back to the wall of your Mosque.

[Adversary2Arabs]

Frist of all they say "...with backs to Jerusalem" because many do in fact. To people west of Israel, they can't help but pray that way. It still remains that they don't care either way.

[Batman]

TEMPLE MOUNT=MOUNT MORIAH:
In the Jewish tradition this is the Foundation Stone, the symbolic foundation upon which the world was created, and the place of the Binding of Isaac.


4000 years ago:
ABRAHAM
God tests Abraham's faith:
Genesis 22:2
"And He said, take now thy only son, Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into THE LAND OF MORIAH and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of"

Many scholars agree that MOUNT MORIAH is traditionally the area we refer to today as TEMPLE MOUNT.

KING DAVID
When King David decided to build a Temple to house the HOly ArK he purchased a large threshing floor which is believed to be on the TEMPLE MOUNT

2 Samuel: 24:18
"And God came that day to David and said to him, go up and rear an altar unto the Lord in the threshing floor of Arounah the Jebusite"

2 Samuel: 24:24

"So David bought the threshing gloor for fifty shekels of silver"

KING SOLOMON

This time it's a much more direct refernece to the TEMPLE MOUNT being Mount Moriah

2 Chronicales: 3:1
"Then Solo,pm began to build the House of the Lord at Jerusalem in MOUNT MORIAH where the Lord appeared to David his father, in the place that David had prepared in the threshing floor of Orran The Jebusite."

THE EARLY SECOND TEMPLE

The first Temple built by King Solomon was destroyed by the Babylonians under the command of Nebuchadnessar in 587 B.C.E

2 Kings: 25:9
"And he (Nebuchadnessar) burnt the House of the Lord , and the King's house and all the houses of Jerusalem."

The Jews were driven into exile to Babylon and it wasn't until about 80 years later that they were fgiven permission to return to Jerusalem by the decriee of Cyrus I , KIng of Persia who hadconquered Babylon.
Unfortunately they lacked the financial and human resources to be able to resoter Solomon's Temple to its original ssplendor. Nevertheless the Hasmonaeans rededicated the Temple and accorded it full honor.
After Alexander the Great who conquered Persia, Hellenistic culture, an amalgamof Greek and early eastern cultures, grew dominant under the Seleucids. Antiochus IV (175-163 BCE) declared Jerusalem a Greek "polis" = "Antiochia of Jerusalem."

In 168 BCE the Hasmonean revolt, (against the led by Judah Maccabee, broke out. Jerusalem was liberated and the Temple was purified and restored as the people's spiritual center. Some 20 years later, Simeon the Maccabee defeated the Hellenistic Jews, and ushered in an 80-year period of Jewish political independence in Jerusalem.


THE SECOND TEMPLE OF KING HEROD

In 37 BCE unbridled ambition and high-level intrigues brought to power Herod Antipater, under Roman patronage.
Several hunderd years passed and then Kind Herod the Great built what is known historically as the Second Temple. This became the focal point of the entire Jewish world.

The most holy site for every Jew today is the WEstern Wakk, This is all that remains of what was actually a supporting waall built by King Herod while expanding the Temple Mount area during the construction of the Second Temple which began in 20 C.E.

The Second Temple was totally destroyed by the Romans during the first revolt in 70 C.E. The disaster of the destruction is commemorated annually on the 9th of the Hebrew month of Av.

Full description of the 2nd Temple is to be found in Josephus (historian) Antiq. Book 15 - Ch. 11 Pages 334-336.

The Dome of the Rock was built (684 A.D.)over the threshing floor purchased by King David, the FIRST TEMPLE of King Solomon and the SECOND TEMPLE of King Herod the Great.




info from: http://jeru.huji.ac.il/ec1.htm
and : Inside Old Jerusalem by Muriel and Marty Isaacs

[Kapiti]

I understand the Hebrews and Israelites were the original descendants of the people now called Jews.

I understand that Passover celebrates these people travelling to what is now Israel/Palestine from Egypt in about the year 1500 BC.

What connection did the Hebrews/Israelites have with Israel/Palestine before 1500 BC.

Where can I learn more about this period and this connection. Any websites covering this history.

Thankyou.

[Adversary2Arabs]

Originally posted by Kapiti
I understand the Hebrews and Israelites were the original descendants of the people now called Jews.

I understand that Passover celebrates these people travelling to what is now Israel/Palestine from Egypt in about the year 1500 BC.

What connection did the Hebrews/Israelites have with Israel/Palestine before 1500 BC.

Where can I learn more about this period and this connection. Any websites covering this history.

Thankyou.

Arbraham was an inhabitant of this land after he left from Ur, where he was from, due to the idolitry. If I rememeber correctly, G-d told him to go out and find it. My extremely ancient Jewish history is a little hazy.

[Batman]

Originally posted by Kapiti
I understand the Hebrews and Israelites were the original descendants of the people now called Jews.

I understand that Passover celebrates these people travelling to what is now Israel/Palestine from Egypt in about the year 1500 BC.

What connection did the Hebrews/Israelites have with Israel/Palestine before 1500 BC.

Where can I learn more about this period and this connection. Any websites covering this history.

Thankyou.

Bible
According to the Bible the world was created 5760 years ago by the word of G-d.

Man was created in the image of G-d on the sixth and final day of creation and on the seventh day he rested.

The Bible gives a very detailed record of the entire creation, followed by the flood of Noah and the birth of Abraham who was the first to recognize G-d and the father of the Jewish nation.

Throughout the Bible we find G-d's promises to give the Land of Israel to Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and their descendants for all future generations.
The following is a brief selection of Biblical sources that demonstrate the Jewish ownership of the Land of Israel , both through divine promise and aquistion.

G-d appeared to Abram and said, "To your offspring I will give this land."Genesis 12, 7

G-d said to Abram… "Raise now your eyes and look out from where you are: northward, southward, eastward and westward. For all the land that you see, to you will I give it, and to your descendants forever." Genesis 13, 14-15 G-d said to Abram…"Arise, walk about the land through its length and breadth! For to you will I give it." Genesis 13, 17

Abraham purchases Cave of Machpela in Hebron . Genesis 15, 7. 15, 18-21. 17, 8. 23, 16-18.

G-d promises that Isaac shall inherit Abraham . Genesis 17, 19. 21, 12

Abraham gives all his possessions to Isaac. Genesis 25, 5.

Abraham was buried in the Cave of Machpela. Genesis 25, 10.

G-d promises Isaac that He will fulfill His promise of the land to Abraham. Genesis 26, 3-4.

Isaac hands down the promise of the land to Jacob . Genesis 28, 4.

G-d promises the Land of Israel to Jacob. Genesis 28, 13

Jacob purchases land in Shechem Genesis 33, 19

Genesis 35, 12 (G-d promises to give Jacob and his offspring the Land of Israel ). Genesis 48, 21-22 (Jacob gives Joseph Shechem). Genesis 49, 30. 50, 13. 50, 24 (Joseph tells his brothers G-d will remember His promise to Abraham Isaac and Jacob ).

G-d tells Moses to tell the Jews that He will bring them to the land promised to Abraham Isaac and Jacob Exodus 6, 8

Moses promises redemption and the Jewish inheritance of Israel. Deuteronomy 30, 3-5

Rashi's Commentary
The first Rashi commentary on the Bible (Genesis 1, 1) quotes the first word from the first verse from the first book of Moses "In the beginning" and asks:
Why does the Torah start with the story of the creation? It should have begun with the first commandment? And Rashi answers based on the verse in psalms 111 which states "the power of his works he declared to his nation in order to give them the heritage of the nations. If the nations accuse Israel of banditry for seizing the lands of the seven nations, Israel can respond, the entire universe belongs to G-d. He created it and He granted it to whomever He deemed fit. It was His wish to give it to them and it was His wish to take it from them and give it to us."

Additional sources & citations from the Bible, Talmud, Midrash, Shulchan Aruch (Code of Law) and other classic authoritative texts will be added gradually.

Source: http://www.truepeace.org/torah.html


The Patriarchs and the Origins of Judaism ......
...Abraham was born under the name Abram in the city of Ur in Babylonia in the year 1948 from Creation (circa 1800 BCE)......
READ MORE AT:
http://www.jewfaq.org/origins.htm

The Land of Israel

......The Promised Land
The history of the Jewish people begins with Abraham, and the story of Abraham begins when G-d tells him to leave his homeland, promising Abraham and his descendants a new home in the land of Canaan. (Gen. 12). This is the land now known as Israel, named after Abraham's grandson, [AKA Jacob]whose descendants are the Jewish people. The land is often referred to as the Promised Land because of G-d's repeated promise (Gen. 12:7, 13:15, 15:18, 17:8) to give the land to the descendants of Abraham.

The land is described repeatedly in the Torah as a good land and "a land flowing with milk and honey" (e.g., Ex. 3:8). This description may not seem to fit well with the desert images we see on the nightly news, but let's keep in mind that the land was repeatedly abused by conquerors who were determined to make the land uninhabitable for the Jews. In the few decades since the Jewish people regained control of the land, we have seen a tremendous improvement in its agriculture. Israeli agriculture today has a very high yield.

Jews have lived in this land continuously from the time of its original conquest by Joshua more than 3200 years ago until the present day, though Jews were not always in political control of the land, and Jews were not always the majority of the land's population. ....

Children of Israel [AKA Jacob, son of Isaac, grandson of Abraham]
Jacob fathered 12 sons: Reuben, Simeon, Levi, Judah, Zebulun, Issachar, Dan, Gad, Asher, Naphtali, Joseph and Benjamin. They are the ancestors of the tribes of Israel, and the ones for whom the tribes are named. Joseph is the father of two tribes: Manasseh and Ephraim.

Joseph's older brothers were jealous of him, because he was the favorite of their father, and because he had visions that he would lead them all. They sold Joseph into slavery and convinced their father that Joseph was dead. But this was all part of G-d's plan: Joseph was brought into Egypt, where his ability to interpret visions earned him a place in the Pharaoh's court, paving the way for his family's later settlement in Egypt.

The Exodus and the Giving of the Torah
As centuries passed, the descendants of Israel became slaves in Egypt. They suffered greatly under the hand of later Pharaohs. But G-d brought the Children of Israel out of Egypt under the leadership of Moses.

PARTIAL TIME LINE
for more see:
http://www.beingjewish.com/mesorah/timeline.html
Event Jewish Calendar Gentile Calendar BCE
Creation 1 -3760
Noah and the Flood 1656 -2104
Abraham born 1948 -1812
Covenant Between the Parts 2018 -1742
Isaac born 2048 -1712
Jacob & Family go down to Egypt 2238 -1522
The Exodus 2448 -1312
The Children of Israel enter the Land of Israel 2489 -1271
King David born 2854 -906
King Solomon born 2912 -848
King Solomon builds the Holy Temple 2935 - 825

[Isiah 2:4]

Originally posted by Batman
...Abraham was born under the name Abram in the city of Ur in Babylonia in the year 1948 from Creation (circa 1800 BCE)......
[/B]

Is this true? That number is Extremely significant!

Does the history of the Jews (Timelines, Dates) correspond with Hebrew numbers and/ or prophecy?

Anyone know any more than me about Hebrew numbers? ( I know very little)

[Batman]

Originally posted by Isiah 2:4
Is this true? That number is Extremely significant!

Does the history of the Jews (Timelines, Dates) correspond with Hebrew numbers and/ or prophecy?

Anyone know any more than me about Hebrew numbers? ( I know very little)

PARTIAL TIME LINE
for more see:
http://www.beingjewish.com/mesorah/timeline.html
Event- Jewish Calendar- Gentile Calendar BCE
Creation 1 -3760
Noah and the Flood 1656 -2104
Abraham born 1948 -1812
Covenant Between the Parts 2018 -1742
Isaac born 2048 -1712
Jacob & Family go down to Egypt 2238 -1522
The Exodus 2448 -1312
The Children of Israel enter the Land of Israel 2489 -1271
King David born 2854 -906
King Solomon born 2912 -848
King Solomon builds the Holy Temple 2935 - 825

[Adversary2Arabs]

Isiah, it is a FACT that Jews were already present in Israel long before Muhammad was born. Even modern historians say that the Koran is a near direct copy of the Torah and Christian holy books written in more compact sentences. Furthermore, before Islam was even invented (mind you I use the word invented), Chrsitianity was already flourishing in Europe. As well all know, Christianity is derived from Judaism from Israel. So if Jews were there first, and have always been since then, why do we have no right to it?

[JustPat]

Batman,

I whole heartedly agree with you as to Israel's titledeed to teh land. There is far too much history to prove it. Unfortunately, I think for some of those who post on this forum you are just urinating in the wind. If it didn't happen yesterday, if it doesn't agree with their position, if they din't like it they accuse you of fabicating facts to support your position. Thanks for the refresher. I have enjoyed it.

[Isiah 2:4]

I whole heartedly agree with you as to Israel's titledeed to teh land. There is far too much history to prove it. Unfortunately, I think for some of those who post on this forum you are just urinating in the wind. If it didn't happen yesterday, if it doesn't agree with their position, if they din't like it they accuse you of fabicating facts to support your position. Thanks for the refresher. I have enjoyed it.

Isiah, it is a FACT that Jews were already present in Israel long before Muhammad was born. Even modern historians say that the Koran is a near direct copy of the Torah and Christian holy books written in more compact sentences. Furthermore, before Islam was even invented (mind you I use the word invented), Chrsitianity was already flourishing in Europe. As well all know, Christianity is derived from Judaism from Israel. So if Jews were there first, and have always been since then, why do we have no right to it?

We do have a right to it. Definitely. I absoulutely agree. But if you look i never send anything differerent.

I asked...ANYONE KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT HEBREW NUMBERS, AND HOW THEY MAY RELATE TO PROPHECY, WISDOM, ETC ETC????

[Kapiti]

I think it is correct to say the people of the ancient region of Israel which we now call Jews lived as the majority and political rulers of the land from the period 1812 BCE till Jacob and Family go to Egypt 1522 BCE (total 290 years)

Then again after the return from Exodus in 1271 through to the time the Romans took control of Jerusalem (by Pompei) in 61 BCE. At best they were the majority and political rulers for another 1210 years.

Assuming that the "Jews" did not drive out or kill all the non-Jews during the period that they dominated and that the non-Jews likewise did not kill all the Jews during their period of domination then both can lay lay to a continuous presence within the land.

Counting up the years from 1812 BCE up until 1948 when either was in power and majority in the land then the Jews were dominant for roughly 1500 years and the non jews were dominant for 2260 years.

Prior to 1948 it appears to me that the non-jews were dominant for more than 60 percent of the time.

Can someone explain to me using reasons other than relgious ones why the people dominant for a minority of the time have a greater historical claim to the land than the people who were dominant for a majority of the time.

[Mercury]

Originally posted by Kapiti
Can someone explain to me using reasons other than relgious ones why the people dominant for a minority of the time have a greater historical claim to the land than the people who were dominant for a majority of the time.

It's very revealing that you put jews vs everyone else.
BTW, can you explain me what you are doing in Australia? After all, the fraction of time the anglosax were dominant there is just minuscule.