For those who still dream of Greater Israel

[Communication]

A FAILED ISRAELI SOCIETY COLLAPSES WHILE ITS LEADERS
REMAIN SILENT
By Avraham Burg, Labor Party Knesset member
The FORWARD
August 29, 2003 Issue

The Zionist revolution has always rested on two
pillars: a just path and an ethical leadership.
Neither of these is operative any longer. The Israeli
nation today rests on a scaffolding of corruption, and
on foundations of oppression and injustice. As such,
the end of the Zionist enterprise is already on our
doorstep. There is a real chance that ours will be the
last Zionist generation. There may yet be a Jewish
state here, but it will be a different sort, strange
and ugly.

There is time to change course, but not much. What is
needed is a new vision of a just society and the
political will to implement it. Nor is this merely an
internal Israeli affair. Diaspora Jews for whom Israel
is a central pillar of their identity must pay heed
and speak out. If the pillar collapses, the upper
floors will come crashing down.

The opposition does not exist, and the coalition, with
Arik Sharon at its head, claims the right to remain
silent. In a nation of chatterboxes, everyone has
suddenly fallen dumb, because there's nothing left to
say. We live in a thunderously failed reality. Yes, we
have revived the Hebrew language, created a marvelous
theater and a strong national currency. Our Jewish
minds are as sharp as ever. We are traded on the
Nasdaq. But is this why we created a state? The Jewish
people did not survive for two millennia in order to
pioneer new weaponry, computer security programs or
anti-missile missiles. We were supposed to be a light
unto the nations. In this we have failed.

It turns out that the 2,000-year struggle for Jewish
survival comes down to a state of settlements, run by
an amoral clique of corrupt lawbreakers who are deaf
both to their citizens and to their enemies. A state
lacking justice cannot survive. More and more Israelis
are coming to understand this as they ask their
children where they expect to live in 25 years.
Children who are honest admit, to their parents'
shock, that they do not know. The countdown to the end
of Israeli society has begun.

It is very comfortable to be a Zionist in West Bank
settlements such as Beit El and Ofra. The biblical
landscape is charming. From the window you can gaze
through the geraniums and bougainvilleas and not see
the occupation. Traveling on the fast highway that
takes you from Ramot on Jerusalem's northern edge to
Gilo on the southern edge, a 12-minute trip that
skirts barely a half-mile west of the Palestinian
roadblocks, it's hard to comprehend the humiliating
experience of the despised Arab who must creep for
hours along the pocked, blockaded roads assigned to
him. One road for the occupier, one road for the
occupied.

This cannot work. Even if the Arabs lower their heads
and swallow their shame and anger forever, it won't
work. A structure built on human callousness will
inevitably collapse in on itself. Note this moment
well: Zionism's superstructure is already collapsing
like a cheap Jerusalem wedding hall. Only madmen
continue dancing on the top floor while the pillars
below are collapsing.

We have grown accustomed to ignoring the suffering of
the women at the roadblocks. No wonder we don't hear
the cries of the abused woman living next door or the
single mother struggling to support her children in
dignity. We don't even bother to count the women
murdered by their husbands.

Israel, having ceased to care about the children of
the Palestinians, should not be surprised when they
come washed in hatred and blow themselves up in the
centers of Israeli escapism. They consign themselves
to Allah in our places of recreation, because their
own lives are torture. They spill their own blood in
our restaurants in order to ruin our appetites,
because they have children and parents at home who are
hungry and humiliated.

We could kill a thousand ringleaders and engineers a
day and nothing will be solved, because the leaders
come up from below from the wells of hatred and anger,
from the "infrastructures" of injustice and moral
corruption.

If all this were inevitable, divinely ordained and
immutable, I would be silent. But things could be
different, and so crying out is a moral imperative.

Here is what the prime minister should say to the
people:

The time for illusions is over. The time for decisions
has arrived. We love the entire land of our
forefathers and in some other time we would have
wanted to live here alone. But that will not happen.
The Arabs, too, have dreams and needs.

Between the Jordan and the Mediterranean there is no
longer a clear Jewish majority. And so, fellow
citizens, it is not possible to keep the whole thing
without paying a price. We cannot keep a Palestinian
majority under an Israeli boot and at the same time
think ourselves the only democracy in the Middle East.
There cannot be democracy without equal rights for all
who live here, Arab as well as Jew. We cannot keep the
territories and preserve a Jewish majority in the
world's only Jewish state not by means that are humane
and moral and Jewish.

Do you want the greater Land of Israel? No problem.
Abandon democracy. Let's institute an efficient system
of racial separation here, with prison camps and
detention villages. Qalqilya Ghetto and Gulag Jenin.

Do you want a Jewish majority? No problem. Either put
the Arabs on railway cars, buses, camels and donkeys
and expel them en masse or separate ourselves from
them absolutely, without tricks and gimmicks. There is
no middle path. We must remove all the settlements all
of them and draw an internationally recognized border
between the Jewish national home and the Palestinian
national home. The Jewish Law of Return will apply
only within our national home, and their right of
return will apply only within the borders of the
Palestinian state.

Do you want democracy? No problem. Either abandon the
greater Land of Israel, to the last settlement and
outpost, or give full citizenship and voting rights to
everyone, including Arabs. The result, of course, will
be that those who did not want a Palestinian state
alongside us will have one in our midst, via the
ballot box.

That's what the prime minister should say to the
people. He should present the choices forthrightly:
Jewish racialism or democracy. Settlements or hope for
both peoples. False visions of barbed wire, roadblocks
and suicide bombers, or a recognized international
border between two states and a shared capital in
Jerusalem.

But there is no prime minister in Jerusalem. The
disease eating away at the body of Zionism has already
attacked the head. David Ben-Gurion sometimes erred,
but he remained straight as an arrow. When Menachem
Begin was wrong, nobody impugned his motives. No
longer. Polls published last weekend showed that a
majority of Israelis do not believe in the personal
integrity of the prime minister yet they trust his
political leadership. In other words, Israel's current
prime minister personally embodies both halves of the
curse: suspect personal morals and open disregard for
the law combined with the brutality of occupation and
the trampling of any chance for peace. This is our
nation, these its leaders. The inescapable conclusion
is that the Zionist revolution is dead.

Why, then, is the opposition so quiet? Perhaps because
it's summer, or because they are tired, or because
some would like to join the government at any price,
even the price of participating in the sickness. But
while they dither, the forces of good lose hope.

This is the time for clear alternatives. Anyone who
declines to present a clear-cut position black or
white is in effect collaborating in the decline. It is
not a matter of Labor versus Likud or right versus
left, but of right versus wrong, acceptable versus
unacceptable. The law-abiding versus the lawbreakers.
What's needed is not a political replacement for the
Sharon government but a vision of hope, an alternative
to the destruction of Zionism and its values by the
deaf, dumb and callous.

Israel's friends abroad Jewish and non-Jewish alike,
presidents and prime ministers, rabbis and lay people
should choose as well. They must reach out and help
Israel to navigate the road map toward our national
destiny as a light unto the nations and a society of
peace, justice and equality.

Translated by J.J. Goldberg.

Avraham Burg was speaker of Israel's Knesset from 1999
to 2003 and is a former chairman of the Jewish Agency
for Israel. He is currently a Labor Party Knesset
member. This essay is adapted by the author from an
article that appeared in Yediot Aharonot.

[Communication]

Separation now

By Amram Mitzna



It's hard to say that the liquidation of an
arch-terrorist causes anyone in Israel to shed a
tear. They are despicable, balking at nothing to
murder innocent Israelis, and therefore they
deserve to die. But that is not the question. The
only question we should ask ourselves is, what is
best for us. Is the government's campaign of
assassinations now being waged against the
terrorist organizations serving the Israeli
interest and contributing to the enhancement of



security?

Voicing the slogan we all
remember, "Make it possible for
the IDF [Israel Defense Forces]
to win," Ariel Sharon assured
the public that he was the only
one capable of defeating
terrorism. He won the elections
but has not won against the
terrorists. Nor has the IDF. On

the contrary: Over the past three years, the
security of Israel's citizens has deteriorated
to a level that is without parallel in the
country's history. This is the reality - but it
doesn't have to be that way. Leaders are
elected in order to change the reality, in
order to lead, not to yield to the dictates of
someone else, least of all terrorist
organizations. But that is just what Sharon has
done.

The national interest of the State of Israel -
and there are now those on the right who admit
this - is separation from the Palestinians.
This is the only way to ensure that Israel will
be able to remain a viable Jewish state. We are
currently at a critical point that will decide
whether Israel will continue to exist as a
democratic Jewish state or become a binational
state in which there will be an Arab majority
within a few years.

The original sin of indecision can be traced to
1967. The Six-Day War was a tremendous military
victory but a total political-security failure.
The first person to grasp this was David
Ben-Gurion. He, like many others, was thrilled
and moved at the return to the lands of our
forefathers. However, as a leader bearing
national responsibility for the security of
Israel and the future of the Zionist movement,
Ben-Gurion was able - in contrast to all the
leaders since - to look beyond the horizon, and
called on the government of Israel to leave the
new territories.

Years passed and Israel became ever more mired
in Judea, Samaria and Gaza. By now we are so
mired that we are no longer capable of lifting
our heads and understanding the reality in
which we are living. For years, successive
governments deceived the public by leading it
to believe that holding onto Judea, Samaria and
Gaza is a security necessity, that the
territories are a national asset and that any
concession in them will be detrimental to
security. Yitzhak Rabin decided to snap us out
of this illusionary dream. Rabin was hardly a
member of Peace Now, but he understood what the
terrorist organizations also understand and
what, unfortunately, the government of Ariel
Sharon has yet to understand: that the
continued confrontation with the Palestinians
and the continued Israeli control of Judea,
Samaria and Gaza means the liquidation of
Zionism and the end of the Jewish state. He
understood that control of Judea, Samaria and
Gaza is not an asset but a burden that is
putting our continued survival at risk.

It follows that agreement to the establishment
of a Palestinian state is neither a concession
nor a surrender. It is an asset. There will be
no Jewish state without the existence of a
Palestinian state alongside it. This has to be
the goal and any government policy has to be
examined in its light - including the policy of
targeted assassinations, which, I regret to
say, is the only policy now guiding the
government of Israel.

There is no doubt the cold-blooded murder of
children and of innocent civilians is maddening
and infuriating and that one's primary instinct
is to react. To take revenge. To teach them a
lesson. To make them as afraid as we are. To
make them run. But this is no more than a
dream. In reality, every liquidation engenders
a terrorist attack and more casualties. Instead
of looking ahead, as true leaders should, and
acting to advance the Israeli interest -
namely, separation from the Palestinians - the
government is being sucked into the vicious
circle of terrorism-reaction-terrorism.
Amazingly, however, the policy of liquidations
has not succeeded in vanquishing the
terrorists. In the test of practicality, the
security of Israel's citizens has not improved.
The policy of targeted assassinations has
failed and the time has come to admit it.

We have reached the moment of decision. I expect
Sharon to behave like a leader and understand
that the responsibility for the fate of Israel
rests on his shoulders. Separation from the
Palestinians is the only goal that should be
dictating Israeli policy, and we have no time
to amuse ourselves with the thought that we
will succeed in defeating terrorism by means of
military force. Anyone who says we will is
deceiving the public. If Sharon is right and
"there is no one to talk to" on the other side,
then we have to separate unilaterally, and the
sooner the better.

The writer is a Labor member of Knesset.

[Mediocrates]

This is nonsense. I have 4 pages of handwritten notes I'm compiling into an essay to refute this. It will take a few days and when I'm done it's going out to every policy relevant contact I can think of. The short and the long of it is that Israel must develop a policy independent of any expectations of performance by the PLO and it should formulate it strictly in accordance with following rule of law. Which translates to calling treason treason and sedition sedition. Instead of worrying about a one state or two state or fake state solution. Take the entire discussion off the table completely. Have a single message: Any terrorist attack will be met with ultimate force. Why? Res Ipsa Loquitor.

Take right of return completely off the table forever. When the perpetrator is dead then one can only go against the next best thing, and that is the family. Move all family members to border areas with all Arab states as a human buffer zone and bar them and all of their decendants in perpetuity from ever settling in Israel or Palestine ever.

Create a harsh yet finite response for every attack - say 3 days of 100% all out IDF action followed by one day in the future chosen at random. Apply the same rules to ANY state shown to actively support terrorism.

The last leg of the policy assumes a militia. For example, instead of pulling back settlements, arm the settlers. Give each one a shoulder fired rocket and a gun and when they protect themselves claim simply you can't find them. The key problem is that Palestinians have IT ALL on the line and are willing to lose it all. The Israelis have to put their very existence on the line now and have to be willing, truly willing to lose it all to save themselves. Without it Israel is slowly dying. Israel is not the Red Coats they are the Minutemen. They need to flip this argument around onthe PLO and they have to be unafraid. If it means it all goes up in flames then so be it but the alternatve is slow death.

Sharon is becoming a failure in this regard. Negotiations assume that your partner is interested in negotiating but all the mamby pambying the world attempting to show the PA as unreliable only shows the Israelis to be weak and vacillating.

More to follow. I will refine this and it will go to the MFA, the White House, PNAC and its members personally.

[alexbmn]

posting Labor party articles? They've been marginalized even in Israel

[frizzer1]

I don't think it's all nonsense.As a matter of fact a lot of it makes sense.
But there is the usual fatal flaw, and that is until the arabs accept Israel's right to exist,it makes no difference if Israel dismantles the settlements,withdraws to pre 1967 borders or even treats the palestinians like long lost relatives.
Once the arabs truly accept israel and forego the use of violence forever,only then can israel afford to take the steps recommended in the post.

[Communication]

In the very near future, people around the world are going to call for a bi-national state.

[old-reb]

Originally posted by frizzer1
I don't think it's all nonsense.As a matter of fact a lot of it makes sense.
But there is the usual fatal flaw, and that is until the arabs accept Israel's right to exist,it makes no difference if Israel dismantles the settlements,withdraws to pre 1967 borders or even treats the palestinians like long lost relatives.
Once the arabs truly accept israel and forego the use of violence forever,only then can israel afford to take the steps recommended in the post.

DITTO

Old Reb

[Mediocrates]

Originally posted by frizzer1
I don't think it's all nonsense.As a matter of fact a lot of it makes sense.
But there is the usual fatal flaw, and that is until the arabs accept Israel's right to exist,it makes no difference if Israel dismantles the settlements,withdraws to pre 1967 borders or even treats the palestinians like long lost relatives.
Once the arabs truly accept israel and forego the use of violence forever,only then can israel afford to take the steps recommended in the post.

Until unless - - make no difference. There is no such thing as any solution as long as the Palestinians aren't beholden to law. No one cares if they truly accept anything other responsibility for THEIR OWN actions and policies. There is NO requirement for Israel to bother with any unilateral policy or action until then.

[Mediocrates]

Originally posted by Communication
In the very near future, people around the world are going to call for a bi-national state.

"They" already have. But it's a meaningless request borne of laziness and fatigue. And it's triply silly because neither the Israelis nor the Palestinians will accept that.

[Communication]

actually, the Palestinians are starting to push more and more for a bi-national state, with the right of return as an alternative. They are using Lebanon as a model, which has resulted in the emmigration of close to 900,000 Christians over the years and the naturalization of some 300,000 Syrian Muslims, thereby altering the balance of the Christian/Muslim population. All of this is happening under the guise and ideal of western "multiculturalism," which would be positive, if not for the fact that the end result is the further Islamization of the ME.

But the point is that we are at a cross-roads. Israel cannot keep the Palestinians under occupation forever and Israel is losing the PR battle. The latter is causing the Palestinians to increase their hopes for regaining all of historic Palestine, so if Israel continues to wait for the Palestinians to come to terms with its existence, they will actually decrease their chances of retaining Israel as a Jewish state.

[Communication]

The Lebanon model. I urge you to read this to understand the parallels between the western reaction to the Lebanese conflict and the Israeli-Palestinian conflict and what the future will hold if decisive action isnt taken soon to seperate the Jews from the Muslims in the territories:

http://www.christianitytoday.com/bc/8b5/8b5040.html

[abu afak]

Originally posted by Communication
In the very near future, people around the world are going to call for a bi-national state.

Many Anti-semites and Anti-Israelers are already calling for a 'Bi-National State'.
(ie the Rabid Anti-semite Israel Shamir)
Understanding, of course, demographically, that the State will Be an Arab/Muslim majority in short order; Free to change the Laws constitution, open 'Israel' to even further Arab immigration .. and rather quickly force an end to Israel in any Jewish sense.. or in any Jews sense.

Lebanon has been purged of about 1 milion of it's Christians by the Muslims/Muslim-Syrian Pupppet Goverment there.
The Lebanese 'Civil War' started soon after the arrival of Arafat and co. in 1970 after their failed attempt to overthrow King Hussein and rule the other/real Palestinian state... Jordan
(see 'Black September')

Anyone proposing this 'solution' is a mental midget or someone who wants to see the end of Israel.

[MGB8]

The problem with Mitna and his lefty co-patriots is that they DO NOT THINK ABOUT "the day after."

They think that "give them what they (say that they) want, and they will stop attacking us."

That is possible. History (and polls) tells us, however, that it is HIGHLY UNLIKELY.

What happens if we give the PLO their state today, and we get rocket attacks tomorrow? You have to admit that this is possible...in fact, considering the mission of the PLO, Hamas, etc (the destruction of Israel) and the poll numbers which show that the vast majority of Pal-Arabs still want this, and that most Arab states also do not recognize Israel's right to exists (and most Arabs, too, regardless of nationality)....what does Israel do? Re-Invade? How many die then?

Or, what if attacks stop for a while, but with open boarders, they build up their forces (like they did in 1993 - 2000 when Israel STILL HAD MILITARY CONTROL - mostly) but with no impediments add Chemical and Biological weapons, more accurate missles, and bigger warheads?

What if they decide to rip up the "peace of paper" and attack, but claim that its just "Terrorist factions" that they couldn't possibly stop - like Pakistan/India?

What do you do then, Communication? Mitna?

And what happens as a reaction to what you do - regional war??

These scenarios are THE MOST LIKELY OUTCOMES!!!! Allowing them to come to pass is INCOMPETENCE, at best, and TRAITOROUS TO YOUR PEOPLE, at worst.

[ibrodsky]

Originally posted by abu afak
Many Anti-semites and Anti-Israelers are already calling for a 'Bi-National State'.
(ie the Rabid Anti-semite Israel Shamir)
Understanding, of course, demographically, that the State will Be an Arab/Muslim majority in short order; Free to change the Laws constitution, open 'Israel' to even further Arab immigration .. and rather quickly force an end to Israel in any Jewish sense.. or in any Jews sense.

Lebanon has been purged of about 1 milion of it's Christians by the Muslims/Muslim-Syrian Pupppet Goverment there.
The Lebanese 'Civil War' started soon after the arrival of Arafat and co. in 1970 after their failed attempt to overthrow King Hussein and rule the other/real Palestinian state... Jordan
(see 'Black September')

Anyone proposing this 'solution' is a mental midget or someone who wants to see the end of Israel.

Right. In fact, they call for a "secular" bi-national state--as if Islam has been reconciled with Western principles and values.

In reality, the plan is to first delegitimze Israel as a Jewish state. Then flood that state with Muslims. Then suddenly demand "true democracy" in the form of a Muslim-dominated government.

There is no lie, no ruse, no slander, and no evil act that Israel's Arab enemies won't try to destroy Israel.

[Communication]

Ok, let's talk about our options here:

1. continue on with the road map in the hopes that we can reach an agreement with the PA.

2. transfer

3. attempt to destory the terrorist infrastructure.

4. unilateral seperation.

5. Other suggestions.


Israel is receiving the most presure to pursue option number 1. I wrote a whole post on why option 1 won't work, namely that the terror groups have more credability than the PA with the Palestinian people and the PA itself is divided on what would be acceptable upon final neogtiation. If you look at the history of Oslo, the road map is a repeat of that. Both sides were urged to move forards despite breaches on each side, until we reached Camp David and then Taba, only for everything to break down and the violence started. If you look at what was achieved at Taba, where Israel went even further in their concessions to the PA, you will see that despite all the rhetoric about non-continguous land and such other excuses, the real reasons for the break down had to do with control over holy sites, but even more so, the right of return. And this is so even with Israel having granted a limlited right of return under a family reunification program. Still no deal. Why? Because Arafat did not want to be a martyr for peace. He does not want to end up like Sadat. With Nabil Shaath saying that implicit in the road map is the Palestinian right of return, is their any doubt that they are foreshadowing another break down exactly like what we saw the last time?

2. Out of the question. The world will turn on Israel the next day and Israel become even more of a pariah state than it is now.

3. International condemnation over Operation Defensive Shield, and it still didn't result in a total dismantling of the terror infrastructure. The terrorists have gone underground, and with each one that is killed, some 10+ civilians are injured. Without the hope for a better future, a new crop of terrorists will take their place.

4. Unilateral seperation involves facing the settlers. Perhaps they could be temprorarily jailed, assuming that Israel has the space for them. The wall is completed. And yes, rockets can fly over fences and then Israel still has to worry about the Israeli Arabs. However, they will be in a defensive position, once the occupation ends. They will therefore have a greater ability to defend themselves against attacks. IN addtion, Israel can take some additional land to secure itself starting around Netanya on down, including the most strategic hill locations. Israel can take land from the local Palestinians and offer them money in return for moving further out into the West Bank. Yes, Israel will receive an outcry from the world for this, but if it is done at the same time that settlements are abandoned, it will be more justifiable from a position of defense. If Hezbollah wanted to, they could probably lob over a few chemical warheads right now. At some point, it just doesn't matter how much land is salvaged.

5. Let's here them....


I'm ready to hash it out, and then afterward I want all your lazy internet hooked a$$es to work with me to send out a statement to as many news sources and political represenatives that we can. I will help work on the statement and provide all the e-mail addresses.