Like2Talk

[Canajew]

I know this is not the right place for this but I know of no other way to both communicate with those responsible and bring this to the attention of the wider community. If this is true it is patently unaccpetbale. Regardless of the views espoused by anyone, they should not be banned from this site unless it is clear they are simply interested in making it more difficult for others to communicate. To have someone banned for the expression of views that do not accord with majority opinion is unacceptable, particularly given some of the inflamatory comments comming out of our side on many things.

I want this issue resolved to my satisfaction. L2T should be re-instated and policies must be developed so that there are precise, consistent rules that apply equally to everyone and there is both transparency and accountability in the decision making process. I would appreciate others lending their support here on principle, noting thata it is not necessary to agree with the contents of another's speech in order to agree with the principle that a free and open forum should allow those contents to be espoused.

Thank you.

This is the message:

Hello this is Like2talk,

It appears I have been fired from posting on Israelforum. This was a bit surprising because until then I only noticed one of my posts had been suppressed (but I had no explanations either). However I did have menacing messages from newguy weeks ago (which had answered by pointing to Negative Mitzvah 302. Probably not the kind of reasoning the forum owners here listen
to). Not hateful enough a Mitzvah... I'd say The fact that I pointed out that antisemistim in Europe was on a decreasing trend in the last 12 years was not appreciated either… since it breaks the very logic of the forum is to say "we are hated by everybody, so we are allowed to hate them".

...

Farewell and note the policy of silencing people who do not agree with by forums owners to make it look as if many jews are extreme-right is just another proof that this forum does not deserves to bear the name of Israel. I am Israel and no policy of opinion-cleansing is justifiable!

with that last comment I agree whole-heartedly, and again, I expect this issue to be dealt with promptly by the pwers that be, whoever they are.

[Oh Jerusalem]

I was not aware the L2T was banned.

What did he say to get banned?

[danholo]

Seems like people are scared of people who hold different opinions. Pathetic.

On Israel though, people like that just make me angry but banning them from this board, which requires differing and at least opposite opinions, is ridiculous. At least Like2Talk got some arguments going - at this rate this board will become the "Yes-man" board. Boring.

[Ahava]

I agree with Canajew.
She said nothing worse than before for what she could've been banned, I believe.

[Oh Jerusalem]

Originally posted by Ahava
I agree with Canajew.
She said nothing worse than before for what she could've been banned, I believe.

I'm not willing to agree or disagree until I know what was said.

Is there a moderator here who can enlighten us?

[Mira~]

I agree with everyone above. Banning should be for abusive posters. Like2talk was not abusive/offensive from what I read. She has a sense of humor too.

[Binyamin]

No one should be banned for expressing their opinion, and I do not think they would be. If someone wants to argue that Israel has no right to exist, they should be able to, but only if they have something intelligent to say.

L2T never argued logically. He liked to rant and rave, and there is no reason he should be allowed to do that here. He was banned for idiocy, not for having offensive views.

[andak01]

Originally posted by danholo
At least Like2Talk got some arguments going - at this rate this board will become the "Yes-man" board. Boring.

Don't speak so fast. I'll be around as long as my keyboard holds out and my daughter doesn't take up sports!

Sadly, it's reached a point where I no longer even read posts by someone when they are being attacked. Any assistance I could render would only cause them to be further attacked. I received a PM from Like2Talk and haven't returned it yet. Frankly, I divorced myself from any threads that she(?) was in. I would be willing to review some of them and throw in my two cents.

[Ahava]

Originally posted by Oh Jerusalem
I'm not willing to agree or disagree until I know what was said.

Is there a moderator here who can enlighten us?

It may have been her new signature even though I don't know what it was (the banning went fast and unnoticed until after it was done - to me at least).

[Oh Jerusalem]

Originally posted by Binyamin
L2T never argued logically. He liked to rant and rave, and there is no reason he should be allowed to do that here. He was banned for idiocy, not for having offensive views.

Every forum needs its own village idiot.

Idiocy is not a reason to ban someone.

[Canajew]

Originally posted by Binyamin
No one should be banned for expressing their opinion, and I do not think they would be. If someone wants to argue that Israel has no right to exist, they should be able to, but only if they have something intelligent to say.

L2T never argued logically. He liked to rant and rave, and there is no reason he should be allowed to do that here. He was banned for idiocy, not for having offensive views.

On the contrary, there is no reason why she shoujld NOT be allowed to do so here. This is an open forum, after all, and one should not have some closed-ended subjective standard for assessing whether anyone falls short of your definition of constructive dialogue.

Again, there should be clear rules with respect of what is alloowed and what is not, though these rules must be fair and constructive, allowing for the widest range of discussion possible. While racial insults and the like should not be tolerated, there should be no question that particular opinions, however objectionable (including, I believe, such objectionable issues such as ethnic clensing or collective punishment or even support for terrorism) should not be grounds for prohibition from participation.

Once these rules are in place, they should be applied consistently and transparently, and moderators should be responsible to the rest of the forum in providing justifications for such drastic measures. They should not have the power to ban people on whims or based on personal preferences.

Even when people are to be banned for cause, there must be an open and transparent process, with sufficient time for offenders to rectify whatever defficiencies the moderators might point to.

and thanks to everyone for their comments of support on this. I hope this is a start to having this fixed and making sure this never happens again. I remember someone getting panned last summer (unbiased maybe, or reason) who sent me a personal message asking for help, but I was out of town and had no access to the internet. I let that one slide because I was relatively new and did not feel I could affect policy, but I have been around for longer now and I think this practice of banning people should stop, unless they are flamers (not flamers like gay people but internet flamers ).

People who come on with their antisemetic claptrap should be allowed to stay, though those who are pro Israel should not be permitted as wide a lattitude to engage in racist discourse about our opponents. We must be tolerant, even if they are not.

[Mira~]

Originally posted by Canajew
I remember someone getting panned last summer (unbiased maybe, or reason) who sent me a personal message asking for help, but I was out of town and had no access to the internet. I let that one slide

that was yahoodi, another french-fry . I let it slide too, but for other reasons.

[Canajew]

Originally posted by Mira
that was yahoodi, another french-fry . I let it slide too, but for other reasons.

right. It was so long between when it happened and when I found out that I figured it was too late to do anything. What did he do, I don't remeber him being anything but argumentative and a little obstinant, which is also no reason to ban people. It is a slippery slope to dictatorship after all. Are the moderators interested in holing thems\elves up in a site they can turn into their own personal Mukata or what?

[Ahava]

Originally posted by Canajew
right. It was so long between when it happened and when I found out that I figured it was too late to do anything. What did he do, I don't remeber him being anything but argumentative and a little obstinant, which is also no reason to ban people. It is a slippery slope to dictatorship after all. Are the moderators interested in holing thems\elves up in a site they can turn into their own personal Mukata or what?

If only there were such people on the maroc forum I was banned from a while ago... There were a few who stood up for me (Dutch guys) but they couldn't do anything because they were on "the wrong side" of opinion too and at risk of getting banned aswell (3 of them are banned aswell by now), but all the others (mainly Moroccans, obviously) were as bad as the moderator, I was a bad zionist propagandist etc. The policy on that forum was outrageous, so unfair.

[David_in_NYC]

Originally posted by Canajew
right. It was so long between when it happened and when I found out that I figured it was too late to do anything. What did he do, I don't remeber him being anything but argumentative and a little obstinant, which is also no reason to ban people. It is a slippery slope to dictatorship after all. Are the moderators interested in holing thems\elves up in a site they can turn into their own personal Mukata or what?

Well, this is a privately-owned website, and as such, the owner can do as he pleases.

If Like2Talk had anything to contribute other than a constantly-recycled, barely-veiled hostility to all things Jewish, I'd be the first to stand up in his/her defense.

But the reality is that L2T did nothing here but troll, bait, fabricate, and regurgitate enemy propoganda.

Opposing opinions are great. Rampant, blatant dishonesty is not.

If you guys like to put up with genocide deniers, more power to you. I don't, so I won't mourn the loss of a waste of everybody's time.

Since the heat is on, might as well clean house and take out takeo and Northlander as well.