Start a civil war Palestinian vrs. Palestinian

[L@mplighterM]

*

[Belgium@EU]

Originally posted by L@mplighterM


Perhaps I?m being naïve.

Some thoughts.

You're not naive, you're just a dangerous person!!!! Did you mean this? What kind of freak are you????? Gosh, I thought you were stupid and narrow-minded, but I never though you would think of going that far. If Israel would do such a thing (which they won't because not all Israeli's are so low as you), they would lose all sympathy, which means they'll end up in the sea again.

But I forgot i'm on a ISRAELI forum here. My goal was to see if there are some moderate Israeli's. I found some, but there also seem to be some extremists. Pity ....

[Vic]

Originally posted by Belgium@EU
But I forgot i'm on a ISRAELI forum here. My goal was to see if there are some moderate Israeli's. I found some, but there also seem to be some extremists. Pity ....

"I wanted to find out whether the Jews are as bad as they told me, see, I did find it out, and all of it your fault..."

[Vic]

Originally posted by L@mplighterM
The danger exists that they would turn against the Israelis. What I?m proposing is to start a civil war so they can clean up their own mess.

Perhaps I?m being naïve.

Some thoughts.

Wasn't it what they tried in Lebanon?

[L@mplighterM]

There must be those that want to be freed from the clutches of Arafag. Hundreds that have gone against Arafag are in jails or have been executed.

Indications are that there’s some discontent within the PA. Muslims are notorious when it comes to murdering each other. They talk with one tongue yet stab each other in the back; killing is their way of life.

Sponsoring civil wars isn’t anything new there’s plenty of precedents for that in history. As a matter of fact I believe that if a division would have been created in the territories a long time ago and it would have reduced the fundamentalist elements things would be better for Israel.

The problem is that evil has been allowed to flourish and grow relatively unchecked. Lasting peace will not be a reality in the ME all you can do is minimize the situation. Israel allowing the establishment of the PA and allowing Arafag’s return from exile has proven itself to be errors in miscalculations.

There’s nothing new in what I suggested as far as I’m concerned. Establishing a force guerrillas/soldiers/freedom fighters call it what you like is exactly what’s required to deal with the situation.

[takeo]

Israel has done this already, in the 80's they helped to form hamas to undermine Arafat.
The only palestinians you will manage to arm against Arafat are real fundamentalist extremists, but those israeli weapons could well end in Israel in an undesired place. Of course all of it would be Arafat's responsability as always...

[thrud]

I do not think Israel helped form Hamas (I don't think you would say that out loud if you were surrounded by a bunch of Hamasians).

I do think that Samaria and Gaza are two different localities that assar will not be able to control. I think he should cut hs losses and let Gaza find their own way.

I think there will be a Palestinian civil war with Hamas taking Hamas and Fatah/PLO taking Samaria.

[Vic]

Originally posted by L@mplighterM
There must be those that want to be freed from the clutches of Arafag. Hundreds that have gone against Arafag are in jails or have been executed.

The problem is that some of them are not exactly noble-minded. You'd easily end up with a situation even worse than the current one. Just imagine the results if your "good guys" would turn out to be al-Qaeda members...
To the best of my knowledge most of the Palestinians who are opposed in this way or other to Arafat and who are worth dealing with are not exactly the warrior type.

[ibrodsky]

Originally posted by Belgium@EU


You're not naive, you're just a dangerous person!!!! Did you mean this? What kind of freak are you????? Gosh, I thought you were stupid and narrow-minded, but I never though you would think of going that far. If Israel would do such a thing (which they won't because not all Israeli's are so low as you), they would lose all sympathy, which means they'll end up in the sea again.

You are so right. The terrorists must stick together under a dictator who shoots "collaborators" (i.e., Palestinian moderates who oppose the slaughter of Israeli civilians).

But I forgot i'm on a ISRAELI forum here. My goal was to see if there are some moderate Israeli's. I found some, but there also seem to be some extremists. Pity ....

Well, we Jews have not quite yet reached the level of civilization attained by Arab groups like Islamic Jihad, Hamas, and Fatah. Perhaps when we start teaching our children to grow up to carry out "martyrdom" operations Europeans will appreciate us.

But seriously, aren't you a little bit ashamed? Your civilization tried to exterminate us in the 1930s and 40s, and now you are starting back down the same path. As George Will observed, Europe has managed to resuscitate anti-semitism without Jews.

To wit, if Israel has not treated the Arabs -- who were allied with Europe's Nazis during WW II and have openly said their goal is to destroy Israel --- perfectly, certainly Europe has no credibility in advising Israel on how to behave.

Of course, this conflict is a real boon to Europeans: it gives you an opportunity to lecture Israel on how to behave. But most people in this forum are not fooled.

[ibrodsky]

L@mplighter, I think your idea is excellent. Really, it's much like the U.S. enlisting the Northern Alliance to smash the Taliban and Al Qaeda.

[Vic]

Originally posted by ibrodsky
L@mplighter, I think your idea is excellent. Really, it's much like the U.S. enlisting the Northern Alliance to smash the Taliban and Al Qaeda.

Sorry, but what is the Palestinian "Northern Alliance"? The PIJ and the Hamas?

[sitruc37diesel]

Originally posted by ibrodsky

But seriously, aren't you a little bit ashamed? Your civilization tried to exterminate us in the 1930s and 40s, and now you are starting back down the same path. As George Will observed, Europe has managed to resuscitate anti-semitism without Jews.

Careful. The dude you're replying to probably wasn't alive then. And he's not German either. Don't lump people together like that.

"your people" "my people" etc. ALL ********. absolutely pure ********. thinking you belong to some group and have allegiances to it and sometimes enmity to another group causes nasty prejudices. Sometimes these prejudices are played upon by some psycho (like hitler and milosevich) and create genocide.

I'm American and of western european ancestry, but I don't care about that. The group i consider to be MY PEOPLE is THE ENTIRE HUMAN RACE. others should think likewise.

[Gatorade]

While I agree it isn't fair to discriminate or hold individuals, or people responsible today for what their country did 50 years ago, on the other hand, history shouldn't be forgotten.

Jews would have wished to have been viewed as individuals in a larger society as you view people today, but in places like Germany under Hitler, they weren't. So if other people view you differently, one should be be aware how they are being viewed. To ignore it and think of people as all individuals only works if there are only good people in the world, like you describe yourself.

[ibrodsky]

I have read enough of Belgium@EU's posts to know better...

Saying your people is the entire human race is noble. But what do you do when confronted with people who want to kill you, or enslave you, and replace your democratic gov't with an "Islamic" (i.e., fascist) state?

If you really want to be able to say that the entire human race is your people, I think you need to recognize that's not quite possible yet, because there are many groups that live and breathe intolerance.

Note that one million Arabs live in Israel and are represented in Israel's parliament, the Knesset.

Note also that a key Palestinian demand is that the 200,000 Jews living in the disputed territories must leave. Can you say "ethnic cleansing"?

Study the region's history. Pay close attention to what the different groups say and do. Then think about who acts on tribal instincts and who is cosmopolitan.

[L@mplighterM]

Originally posted by ibrodsky
L@mplighter, I think your idea is excellent. Really, it's much like the U.S. enlisting the Northern Alliance to smash the Taliban and Al Qaeda.

Well there are dangers involved but if it’s played right I believe it’s workable. In any event I challenge others to come up with anything better.

Actually the thought came to me shortly after I witnessed a Palestinian being executed for collaborating with Israel. They shot him around 500 times I think and then one big blast with a shot gun in the end.

There must be 100’s if not thousands that suffer the same fate. If they are willing to work against Arafag and the PA their services could be put to better use.

Annex a small part of the West Bank and the Gaza Strip and let them know it eventually will become theirs. The Mossad must have a list of potential recruits. Train them and supply them with armaments and set them to work. Expand the annexed part/parts as required. Let them be Freedom fighters fighting to rid themselves of Arafags evil and indifference towards his people.

I think it’s worth a try and I wouldn’t hesitate embarking on such an action.