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Though it's hard to tell who is the teacher and who is the student
France was a democracy long before arafat was elected, so I think arafat is the student .... with quite a way to go in matter of democratic practice.Though it's hard to tell who is the teacher and who is the student
Though I got to agree with you on the idea it's sometimes "hard to tell who's the teacher"..
http://www.unknownnews.net/rumsfeld-saddam.jpg
Mobutu and France
Duvalier and France
Khomeni and France
Sometime you have to pay for liberty...
ps. for all those names, funny to remark that France housed those guys to clean US mess
Originally Posted by Mediocrates
Complain all you want, but you guys are a bunch of hypocrites. French leaders don't care about promoting democracy, just expanding French influence and the French purse. Everyone knows it, except apparently you two.
I don't complain, I moque the lack of honesty...
...so "moque" youself.
Narcissism is their truest expression of love.
Hi Mira,
Are you able to point a lack of honesty in what I wrote?
Isn't is funny that you point to an advert in New York to make your point. Where's the same sign of free expression, plurality, liberalism, acceptance of differing points of views, and dare I say DEMOCRACY in any Arab country? Or even France!
No, the point is that even at the epicenter of the worst terrorist attacks against this country, we not only allow, but EXPECT dissent, discussion, and debate. All of these things are the norm in democratic nations and were won by the force of arms and maintained by the use and threatened use of arms.
If you don't believe me, then why don't you just take the french army off duty from the gates at CDG and the police off the streets in Paris. Let's see how long the nice, pleasant French society lasts when people realize there are no consequences for their actions.
It is idiotic or just childish to think that democracy works without force. The whole point of democracy is that most people ACCEPT that force will be used if they transgress society so they don't. That isn't the case in non democratic countries, where the expectation is that without force things won't get done.
http://www.forbes.com/home_europe/ne...tr1282413.html
France "protecting" Aristide in C. African Republic
http://www.postwatchmagazine.com/200...rica.html#more
Gaullist Africa Resurrected
Whole villages in Bamileke Cameroun were napalmed by the French Army. Says French pilot, Max Bardet, who participated in some of the mass murders in the jungles. “They killed anything between 300.000 to 400.000 people; a veritable genocide. They virtually annihilated a tribe. It was a matter of spears versus rifles. The natives had no chance and they were butchered exactly like Attila the Hun erased villages.â€
By Ntemfac Aloysius Nkong Ofege
The French are coming! Oh yes, they are! On January 19th, 2001, President Chirac of France will lead his throng to a newly beautified Yaounde, Cameroun’s capital city. Another France-Africa Summit will be underway. The theme of this year’s summit is: holy thy breath: Africa and Globalisation, a frontal attack on US imperialism and its extreme form called globalisation. The view from way away is that the Yaounde Summit is yet another attempt to launch another attack on Anglo-Saxon values (which values, with hindsight do not include the Neanderthalian America neo-conservatism and the bush art of torturing and sexually abusing prisoners of war in Iraq). There are reasons enough for any English-speaking observer to be miffed. We explore the reasons for a legitimate anger at the French.
The Earlier RwandaI
Some forty years ago, between 1952 and 1970, French soldiers murdered some 500.000 Camerounians – Bassas and Bamilekes in the main – in the jungles of French Cameroun.
The mass slaughter of what was then the Army for the Liberation of Kamerun (ANLK), led by a certain Martin Singap, was executed with the blessing of the now-dead Ahmadou, Ahidjo, then president of Cameroun.
Whole villages in Bamileke Cameroun were napalmed by the French Army. Says French pilot, Max Bardet, who participated in some of the mass murders in the jungles. “They killed anything between 300.000 to 400.000 people; a veritable genocide. They virtually annihilated a tribe. It was a matter of spears versus rifles. The natives had no chance and they were butchered exactly like Attila the Hun erased villages.â€
French Defense Minister at the time, Pierre Guillaumat reveals that Ahidjo’s mentor at the time; Foccart dispatched a veritable war machine against the Bamilekes in Cameroun. “Foccart played an important role in this business,†says Guillaumat. “ Between them Ahidjo, Foccart and the French Secret Service crushed the Bamilekes.â€
French military information, now unclassified, reveals that Foccart sent out five divisions, one tank unit, T26 bombers, and a veteran of the ill-fated Indo-China campaign, General Max “The Viking†Briand to savage the Camerounian nationalists.
Charles Van de Lanoitte, Reuters correspondent or Douala (1960-1961) says in one swoop some 40.000 people were killed in bassaland. Arrested nationalists were tortured to death and buried in mass graves. The greatest nightmare for the natives was to be arrested for those arrested never came back alive.
The balançoire, a torture system wherein natives were tied upside down and then flogged on the genitals as they swung from end to end was used massively in French Cameroun.
Bassas and Bamilekes involved in the independence struggle were arrested in their numbers and tortured to death. The death chambers were the infamous BMM (Brigades Mobiles Mixtes) cells scattered all over Francophone Cameroun. The torturer-in chief was no other than the late Fochive Jean.
The French Secret Service (the service for External Documentation and Counter-Espionage) created a local arm in Cameroun to fish out the Camerounian nationalists.
What the world is only just discovering with the direct participation of the French in the ultra mayhem in Rwanda –where 1.500.000 people were slain – is that French genocidal practices in Africa is not new. The French murdered the Arabs and destroyed infrastructure. The French organized another little mayhem in Vietnam until they were thrashed at Dien Bien Phu.
The French have always been guilty of supplying arms to rival warring factions in Africa. Standard French practice is to “flatter the president, fund the opposition, and then arm the rebels.â€
“We have been supplying arms to the FAR (Hutu dominated Rwandan Armed forces) by passing through Goma,†the former French Cooperation Minister, Michel Roussin told a reporter, “But we will reuse that if you publish it.â€
OIL and the Foreign Legion
French design has always been to maintain a strong military presence in the Central and West African pre-carré under the so-called “military defense and cooperation treaties†signed with Francophone Africa at the dawn of independence.
Since independence, France has sustained some 8 military bases and about 10.000 troops in areas as diverse as Chad, the Central African Republic, Cote d’Ivoire, Cameroun and Zaire. These soldiers have always been used to main local dictators in place and sustain French neo-colonialism.
Frightened that the opposition would seep him out of power in 1992, Mr. Biya caused some 500 French troops to move from their base in the Central African Republic and take up positions about Yaounde’s Etoudi Palace. “What are 500 French troops doing at Etoudi?†was a provocative headline by the then Publisher of the Cameroon Post, Paddy Akoh Mbawa, based on a scoop revealed to the newspaper by a top army official. Cameroon’s military intelligence, SEMIL, mounted a manhunt for Mr. Mbawa, not so much, because the veracity of the story was challenged but because the military wanted to know how the journalist got the story.
Between 1962-1994, there were 18 direct French interventions in Africa to maintain French neocolonialism.
French sallies in Africa include:
1. The 1950-1970 forays into Cameroun at the behest of Ahidjo to savage militants of the banned Union des Populations du Cameroun, UPC;
2. The 1962 expedition to maintain Leopold Sedar Senghor in power in Senegal;
3. The 1964 and 1990 intervention in Gabon to maintain Leon Mba and Omar Bongo respectively;
4. Various expeditions in Chad in 1968, 1978, 1983, and 1986 to impose the following dictators: Tombalbaye, Malloum, Hissene Habre.
5. In 1990, the French-backed Idriss Derby. They have since given Mr. Derby the wherewithal to stay in power;
6. In 1978, the French barged into Zaire to save Mobutu. La Legion saute sur Kolwezi is a movie claiming French prowess in the Congo. After being outwitted by a Ugandan-Rwandan backed rebellion led by Kabila, the French took sides with the Bayamulenge-Rwandan Hutu posse that tried to topple Kabila in 1988;
7. The French intervened in Central Africa in 1979 to impose Kolingba. When troops in Central Africa rioted in 1997 over unpaid salaries, the French Foreign Legion moved in;
8. The French oil concern, ELF, was very involved in the 1996-1997 fight in the Congo on the side of Sassou Ngessou against the elected president, Pascal Lissouba;
9. Bongo remains in power in Gabon thanks to hi great cpacity to bribe French politicians through ELF;
10. The French intervened in Togo in 1986 to maintain the tyrant Eyadema;
11. French mercenary, Bob Denard, has, often with the backing of the French government, executed several coup d’états in the Comoros;
12. The French were directly linked to the mayhem in Rwanda. The SAM 6 missile that downed Habyarimana’s plane and triggered the Rwanda massacre came from a French military depot. Even before that, French forces intervened in Rwanda in 1989, 1990 and 1993 to stop the Rwandan Patriotic Front from toppling Habyarimana.
13. In 1994, the French launched Operation Turquoise which, in reality, permitted the Hutu-dominated, Rwandan Armed Forces, FAR to execute a return match against the Tutsi-led Rwandan patriotic Forces;
14. In 1992, the French sent 500 soldiers to keep Mr. Biya in power in Cameroun;
15. The French intervened in the Cote d’Ivoire in 2003 to prop up Laurent Gbagbo
Rwanda vows probe of French genocide role
Chirac would surely like to give Kagame the treatment meted out to Aristide, another negro who grew too large for his breeches.
KIGALI (Reuters) - Rwanda will probe accusations France helped train killers who took part in the central African nation's 1994 genocide, Rwanda's foreign minister says.
Charles Murigande told reporters on Monday:"It will be an objective exercise, we will share the findings with the French government.,"
A draft law approved by the Rwandan cabinet on Friday created an independent commission to investigate France's role. The law must be passed by parliament before the commission can start its work.
"The commission will collect testimony from survivors and from ex-FAR (former army) and Interahamwe who were involved," Murigande said.
While marking the 10th anniversary of the genocide in April, Rwandan President Paul Kagame told mourners France had helped train fighters knowing that they would commit genocide.
France strongly denies this.
"France takes note of the Rwandan government's decision to set up a national commission to 'gather evidence of France's implication in the genocide carried out in Rwanda in 1994," French Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Cecile Pozzo di Borgo said.
MEETING IN PRETORIA
French Foreign Minister Michel Barnier and Murigande discussed the matter last Wednesday during a meeting in the South African capital Pretoria, she said.
France and Rwanda have long been at odds over the French role in the genocide in which some 800,000 Tutsis and politically moderate Hutus died in 100 days of ethnic slaughter.
Murigande denied the move was in retaliation for previous accusations by France over Kagame's involvement in triggering the killings, saying the two countries were trying to improve relations.
Kagame accused France of taking part in the genocide after the Paris newspaper Le Monde published articles blaming him for ordering the shooting down of the plane carrying then-President Juvenal Habyarimana and the Burundian president.
Habyarimana's death triggered Rwanda's mass killings and plunged the heart of the continent into a decade of war and upheaval that is only now slowly abating.
The newspaper reports were based on a six-year inquiry by French Judge Jean-Louis Bruguiere, who was asked to investigate the crash by relatives of the French flight crew.
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