Lebanon loves Syria

danholo · 03-09-2005, 06:53 AM

I'm feeling sarcasm in the air...

**Mediocrates** · 03-09-2005, 07:14 AM

It's not a people's revolution until someone is dancing naked atop an overturned flaming police car. Or, Finland has won the world cup. Or the Lakers lose the champoinship or it's October 30 in Detroit or Chapel Hill beats Duke in a meaningless game.

**Womble** · 03-09-2005, 07:55 AM

Originally Posted by danholo

Womble,

You're missing the simple logic! If Israel wouldn't be there in the first place, none of this would've happened. Arafat would be living his life as an engineer and his secret private life with his boyfriend!

No no no, nothing of this would happen if God did not create Adam and Eve. You have to look for the root causes!

danholo · 03-09-2005, 08:14 AM

Originally Posted by Womble

No no no, nothing of this would happen if God did not create Adam and Eve. You have to look for the root causes!

You shouldn't go that far. After all, they weren't Jewish!

KettleWhistle · 03-09-2005, 10:26 AM

Originally Posted by danholo

Israel going into Lebanon was a mistake on their part, I agree, but staying there was the biggest one.

How was it a mistake? It stopped the barriage of rockets that was shot at the Galilee, didn't it?

As for what the Lebanese think, why do we care? They are not our people, and shouldn't be our priority.

But don't blame me, I'm not propagating democracy in the Middle East. In the Middle East democracy doesn't work. Everybody honest with themselves should acknowledge this. Unfortunately you can't make people in the ME like you when they have a hard time liking each other!

Again, why should we care? Whatever government they want for themselves is their problem. Not our concern. If they want a peace agreement, we can have a peace agreement with them. If they want trade, we can have trade. But that's where it should stop. They are not our friends, and we don't need them to be our friends.

takeo · 03-09-2005, 05:08 PM

I also noticed the many young people attending this demonstration.

yep

Israel going into Lebanon was a mistake on their part, I agree, but staying there was the biggest one. But to blame Israel solely for Lebanon's problems

I didn't say so and I don't think lebanese believe so either

, they really need to do some soul searching of their own. But of course when you are brought up to believe that all your problems are Israel's fault, surely you will back the people who are against it.

of course a common ennemy in such a divided country is handy, but Lebanese know very well they have to blame themselves in the first place, yet they blame Israel for making the problem worse and taking advantage of the civil war to shamefully interphere in Lebanon.

Since Arabs attacked Israel in 1948 which caused a war and massive population exchanges between both sides,

you mean since Israel used this as an excuse to commit massive etnic cleansing, but anyway, Lebanon was one of the countries worst affected by the Palestinian exodus, who exported their problems to Lebanon.

many Palestinians went into Lebanon. Unfortunately Israel had NOTHING to do with the PLO making another state within a state during Arafat's "era", so either their history books are all messed up or the people are messed up.

it was a natural consequence of the situation in palestine, but of course the plo as well as Israel fought their private war in lebanon.

But don't blame me, I'm not propagating democracy in the Middle East. In the Middle East democracy doesn't work.

I don't know, it worked pretty well in lebanon, of course palestinians were not represented, but every other group was.

BS. Don't know about the US but Israel doesn't need another crazy neighbor.

They don't need a crasy neighbour but they don't want a hostile strong neighbour either. And Lebanon, as long as it remains pro-syrian, will remain a tool in the hand of the syrians to get back the stolen Golan-heights.

Israelis are quite happy that they have nothing to do with Lebanon anymore. I believe that the assassination of Hariri was a shock to the Israelis as well as for Lebanese.

I don't know who killed Hariri, but surely the syrians would never be so stupid to perpetrate this, while Israel and the us currently have a lot of benefit in "regime-change" in lebanon.

The Civil War effected Israel as well, you know. And no, the Civil War wasn't Israel fault and probably least so.

Israel was involved, they financed crasy extreme falangists, they were involved very deeply, yet indeed Israel was only one of the many worrying parties involved in this civil war.(Syria, the US, France, Saddam, Iran, Saoudi Arabia, the soviets, etc. )

I mean come on... Or are you talking about what the Lebanese think or what you think?

two different things of course, I made the distinction. "the lebanese" don't exist by the way, they are a people similar to the Jews "take two lebanese and you have three opinions" except for some issues on which all or most lebanese agree.

It starts fires, and then extinguishes them.

it sounds like a very familiar strategy cfr. Iraq, Afghanistan...

takeo · 03-09-2005, 05:31 PM

Originally Posted by Mil

Blood!!!!!!!!! I Want To See Blood!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

you can always go to Iraq, it pays very well these days but difficult to get an insurance, except if you go as a marine, they have group insurance.

**Reffo** · 03-09-2005, 08:17 PM

Originally Posted by Takeo

you mean since Israel used this as an excuse to commit massive etnic cleansing, but anyway, Lebanon was one of the countries worst affected by the Palestinian exodus, who exported their problems to Lebanon.

You keep on harping on the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians even though you know very well that the Palestinian refugee problem resulted from a war that was started by the Palestinians themselves and the Arabs. Nevertheless, let's for the sake of argument accept that it should not have happened anyway and compare this refugee problem to others. For instance, my parents were refugees from Euorope, first because of the Nazi Germans then because of the Communist Russians (according to your definition they were ethnically cleansed both times). However, unlike the Palestinians who became unwitting tools for Arab propaganda against Israel (also propaganda tools for people like you who like to bash Israel), my parents picked themselves up and made a new life on both occasions and they are now not refugees. would you care to comment on this or do you think that this story has no relevance (there are hundreds of thousands of similar stories of other European Jews)?

**Reffo** · 03-10-2005, 01:19 AM

http://www.worldthreats.com/middle_e...om%20Syria.htm

An Anonymous Letter from Syria
Washington DC - February 21, 2005

Please help us- We Syrians live in a terrorist regime! Just read!

Hello, I am a Syrian and I just want people in the world to know what it is like to live in Syria. I ask for nothing. Please just read so you know. I am asking you in humanity's name.

I can't provide my name because the Baath terrorist regime in Syria would torture me like it has done so many of us normal people since 1975 when the current president's father took command of the country by force and through killing others. His son today is the illegal president who took over as if we had a monarchy(It is called republic of Syria)!

I want everyone in the world to know what it feels like to be a Syrian.

Everyone especially in the west thinks a Syrian = terrorist. Please understand that the people of Syria are suffering so much because of the real satanic regime. We are supressed so much. No one dares talk about politics. The economy is bad. All the Baathists and their children have taken over and confiscated the country and people's houses and lands and control everything from businesses to blocked streets...you name it.

Everywhere we go we see guards with machine guns with their guns pointed at our faces. I swear it. Come and see for yourself ! WE ARE OCCUPIED BY A TERRORIST REGIME

Do you know that every 9 Syrian citizens have one intelligence spy (Mukhabaraat) to watch what they do and report to the government. They know everything about everyone. And there is virtually no one in Syria who hasn't been visited by those morons with lots of questioning.

If you open up a successful business and you don't have a partner in the government they will confiscate it!

All restaurants are owned by them. Cell phone companies are owned by them.

Tax free shops are owned by them. The air is owned by them. All industries are theirs. WE LIVE IN SO MUCH FEAR IN OUR COUNTRY!

An average salary is 100 dollars a month! Imagine living like that! We are poor as people. They confiscate our houses and lands and live in them and pay no rent nor do they buy them. We are left homeless. Houses are so expensive we can't buy any.

They drive black mercedes cars and we go in public mini vans that stink and pollute the air terribly. God it is so hot in the summer. We can't use AC because petrol is so expensive. SO we sweat and stink all over each other. The power gets cut off often. Drinking water and water get cut off the taps at midday in the summer. While they have continuous water and power.

Tax on cars is up to 350 percent!! They don't pay tax on their cars. We get charged 20000 US dollars for a Chinese low quality car that is worth 2000-3000 in its home country. We drive Iranian cars worth 1500 US for 15000 US !

We are occupied! They have taken our pride. When and if we travel we get treated like terrorists before we leave and on the borders of foreign countries. We pay for our terrorist regime. Foreign nationals think " He carries a Syrian passport so he has to be a terrorist" ! We are suffering.
We have lost our pride.

50 years ago long before the Baathists came, Syria used to be a respectable country. Poems throughout the ages have been written on the lush fruit gardens and rivers of Damascus. Eversince they came they have cut down every tree and now we have little water. It has become a dessert of ugly Peasant style block dirty buildings! They have killed our country. Ask elders they will tell you that rivers used to flow through houses! They used to drink from these rivers. Fruit gardens everywhere. All gone thanks to the occupying forces within our country. They stole it from us. WE ARE NOW ASHAMED TO BE PROUD OF BEING SYRIAN.

They have raped and kidnapped our women. They have imprisoned our people.

The torture chambers are so famous!

They would "free" prisoners only to shoot them in the back once they are 10 metres away! Why? Because they had a different political view.

We can't get anything done without bribery. The regime does not pay their employees enough so that people would have to bribe them. We pay each other's salaries while they live in palaces and luxury hotels and travel at will.

We can't get jobs - unemployement. While we bleed the head of the gang's father is said to be the world's 10th richest man!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We have so much oil and it all gets sold and the cash goes straight up the "Black House- The palace of Satan Assad's son". The son promised change and has done nothing.

We want to be like you. We want to have a decent job. We want to be able to afford to get married. To buy a car or a house. We can't have any of these things. We can't afford young girl's dowries. They buy the women.

We want to be repected. We want to be able to create without it being taken away from us. We want change. We want to be able to smile. Our hearts bleed rivers that can not be cured. We are dying here !

Oh how we have suffered. Let all you wonderful lucky people know. WE ARE OCCUPIED BY EVIL. They have stolen all that is good and rich in our country but they will never occupy our hearts. Their end is coming.

All I ask of you is to please cut and paste the above and email it to this address and anyone out there. Your friends, work colleagues.etc. Please let it circulate. By doing that you will create an energy of change and pressure and maybe with a little help from you the good people left out there of this tired planet of tyranny and killing we can send them back to the gates of evil where they came from. Thank you and God bless all of you out there whatever nationality and religion you have.

We are all people and we all have the same dreams. Love and peace to all. May God help us!

takeo · 03-10-2005, 05:32 PM

Originally Posted by Reffo

You keep on harping on the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians even though you know very well that the Palestinian refugee problem resulted from a war that was started by the Palestinians themselves and the Arabs. Nevertheless, let's for the sake of argument accept that it should not have happened anyway and compare this refugee problem to others. For instance, my parents were refugees from Euorope, first because of the Nazi Germans then because of the Communist Russians (according to your definition they were ethnically cleansed both times). However, unlike the Palestinians who became unwitting tools for Arab propaganda against Israel (also propaganda tools for people like you who like to bash Israel), my parents picked themselves up and made a new life on both occasions and they are now not refugees. would you care to comment on this or do you think that this story has no relevance (there are hundreds of thousands of similar stories of other European Jews)?

The difference is that many Jews from the Arab countries, from the soviet-Union choose to emigrate and live in the US or Israel, however most palestinians, wether they were literally removed from their houses by israeli soldiers (which is, whatever the reason, a crime) or wether they fled the war but later where refused to return to their homes, choose to return to their homes, but couldn't. That's the big difference.

takeo · 03-10-2005, 05:34 PM

Originally Posted by Reffo

http://www.worldthreats.com/middle_e...om%20Syria.htm

An Anonymous Letter from Syria
Washington DC - February 21, 2005

Please help us- We Syrians live in a terrorist regime! Just read!

Hello, I am a Syrian and I just want people in the world to know what it is like to live in Syria. I ask for nothing. Please just read so you know. I am asking you in humanity's name.

I can't provide my name because the Baath terrorist regime in Syria would torture me like it has done so many of us normal people since 1975 when the current president's father took command of the country by force and through killing others. His son today is the illegal president who took over as if we had a monarchy(It is called republic of Syria)!

I want everyone in the world to know what it feels like to be a Syrian.

Everyone especially in the west thinks a Syrian = terrorist. Please understand that the people of Syria are suffering so much because of the real satanic regime. We are supressed so much. No one dares talk about politics. The economy is bad. All the Baathists and their children have taken over and confiscated the country and people's houses and lands and control everything from businesses to blocked streets...you name it.

Everywhere we go we see guards with machine guns with their guns pointed at our faces. I swear it. Come and see for yourself ! WE ARE OCCUPIED BY A TERRORIST REGIME

Do you know that every 9 Syrian citizens have one intelligence spy (Mukhabaraat) to watch what they do and report to the government. They know everything about everyone. And there is virtually no one in Syria who hasn't been visited by those morons with lots of questioning.

If you open up a successful business and you don't have a partner in the government they will confiscate it!

All restaurants are owned by them. Cell phone companies are owned by them.

Tax free shops are owned by them. The air is owned by them. All industries are theirs. WE LIVE IN SO MUCH FEAR IN OUR COUNTRY!

An average salary is 100 dollars a month! Imagine living like that! We are poor as people. They confiscate our houses and lands and live in them and pay no rent nor do they buy them. We are left homeless. Houses are so expensive we can't buy any.

They drive black mercedes cars and we go in public mini vans that stink and pollute the air terribly. God it is so hot in the summer. We can't use AC because petrol is so expensive. SO we sweat and stink all over each other. The power gets cut off often. Drinking water and water get cut off the taps at midday in the summer. While they have continuous water and power.

Tax on cars is up to 350 percent!! They don't pay tax on their cars. We get charged 20000 US dollars for a Chinese low quality car that is worth 2000-3000 in its home country. We drive Iranian cars worth 1500 US for 15000 US !

We are occupied! They have taken our pride. When and if we travel we get treated like terrorists before we leave and on the borders of foreign countries. We pay for our terrorist regime. Foreign nationals think " He carries a Syrian passport so he has to be a terrorist" ! We are suffering.
We have lost our pride.

50 years ago long before the Baathists came, Syria used to be a respectable country. Poems throughout the ages have been written on the lush fruit gardens and rivers of Damascus. Eversince they came they have cut down every tree and now we have little water. It has become a dessert of ugly Peasant style block dirty buildings! They have killed our country. Ask elders they will tell you that rivers used to flow through houses! They used to drink from these rivers. Fruit gardens everywhere. All gone thanks to the occupying forces within our country. They stole it from us. WE ARE NOW ASHAMED TO BE PROUD OF BEING SYRIAN.

They have raped and kidnapped our women. They have imprisoned our people.

The torture chambers are so famous!

They would "free" prisoners only to shoot them in the back once they are 10 metres away! Why? Because they had a different political view.

We can't get anything done without bribery. The regime does not pay their employees enough so that people would have to bribe them. We pay each other's salaries while they live in palaces and luxury hotels and travel at will.

We can't get jobs - unemployement. While we bleed the head of the gang's father is said to be the world's 10th richest man!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We have so much oil and it all gets sold and the cash goes straight up the "Black House- The palace of Satan Assad's son". The son promised change and has done nothing.

We want to be like you. We want to have a decent job. We want to be able to afford to get married. To buy a car or a house. We can't have any of these things. We can't afford young girl's dowries. They buy the women.

We want to be repected. We want to be able to create without it being taken away from us. We want change. We want to be able to smile. Our hearts bleed rivers that can not be cured. We are dying here !

Oh how we have suffered. Let all you wonderful lucky people know. WE ARE OCCUPIED BY EVIL. They have stolen all that is good and rich in our country but they will never occupy our hearts. Their end is coming.

All I ask of you is to please cut and paste the above and email it to this address and anyone out there. Your friends, work colleagues.etc. Please let it circulate. By doing that you will create an energy of change and pressure and maybe with a little help from you the good people left out there of this tired planet of tyranny and killing we can send them back to the gates of evil where they came from. Thank you and God bless all of you out there whatever nationality and religion you have.

We are all people and we all have the same dreams. Love and peace to all. May God help us!

anonymous letter, yeah right!

**MGB8** · 03-10-2005, 06:06 PM

Takeo, you really are a huge ignoramous with no care for the truth. You are disgusting in your callous indifference to facts. Time and time again you have been exposed as spouting your opinion as fact, only to be proven to be at best mistaken and at worst lying, and most likely somewhere in the middle - you care so much about your politics and being "right" that it doesn't matter to you whether you are factually accurate.

Case in point, the above statement. While it is true that SOVIET JEWS left out of choice, the same cannot be said for the Jewish refugees from the Arab nations. There was violence and extremely anti-semitic laws. There is a reason that there are so few Jews (if any) left in most of the Arab states. Heck, you can't even practice Judaism in many, much less purchase land.

You need to stop being an idiotic teenager who "believes what he wants to believes" and argues that everyone is entitled to their opinion and its all equal even if its based on a pack of lies. Its not. You opinions ARE NOT equal. They are garbage. People might take you more seriously if you didn't over and over again make factual errors, and rarely if ever own up to them. We're not talking about esotaric speculation like "would Russia have eventually defeated Nazi Germany without the US presence in the war." We are talking about basic FACTS, things that either did or did not happen, and you consistently GET THEM WRONG. And its been pointed out to you numerous times. But you don't care.

Do you know what that makes you, other than a fool?

takeo · 03-10-2005, 06:44 PM

Originally Posted by MGB8

Takeo, you really are a huge ignoramous with no care for the truth. You are disgusting in that your callous indifference to facts. Time and time again you have been exposed as spouting your opinion as fact, only to be proven to be at best mistaken and at worst lying, and most likely somewhere in the middle - you care so much about your politics and being "right" that it doesn't matter to you whether you are factually accurate.

Case in point, the above statement. While it is true that SOVIET JEWS left out of choice, the same cannot be said for the Jewish refugees from the Arab nations. There was violence and extremely anti-semitic laws. There is a reason that there are so few Jews (if any) left in most of the Arab states. Heck, you can't even practice Judaism in many, much less purchase land.

You need to stop being an idiotic teenager who "believes what he wants to believes" and argues that everyone is entitled to their opinion and its all equal even if its based on a pack of lies. Its not. You opinion ARE NOT equal. They are garbage. People might take you more seriously if you didn't over and over again make factual errors, and rarely if ever own up to them. We're not talking about esotaric speculation like "would Russia have eventually defeated Nazi Germany without the US presence in the war." We are talking about basic FACTS, things that either did or did not happen, and you consistently GET THEM WRONG. And its been pointed out to you numerous times. But you don't care.

Do you know what that makes you, other than a fool?

Jews were discriminated since the 50's, that's right, but they were not forced to leave, and Israel encouraged them to come to Israel. That's a world of difference compared to the palestinian situation. Stop lying.

http://www.answers.com/topic/immigra...rom-arab-lands

**Mediocrates** · 03-10-2005, 06:47 PM

First off, the common rule of thumb is that event sponsors always overestimate crowd size by a factor of 3. One out of 8 Lebanese did not suddenly congregate in one place.

Secondly Hizbollah was forced to do this flash mob thing out of desperation. They themselves can't be seen as the only pro Syrian group in Lebanon else the Lebanese will toss them out too.

Third, takeo is a rip-n-read placed flack.

**MGB8** · 03-10-2005, 07:16 PM

From your own link, takeo...

Arab Governments Expel Jews
Middle Eastern and North African Jewish communities, came to an end in the 1940s and early 1950s when most Arab governments forced hundreds of thousands of Jews to flee after the 1948 Arab-Israeli War, the Palestinian exodus, and the creation of the state of Israel.

Arab governments promulgated edicts that removed Jews from public service, and barred them from entering universities, traveling abroad or buying and selling property. Such harsh laws caused more than 100,000 Iraqi Jews to emigrate to Israel in 1951 in an airlift known as Operation Ezra and Nehemiah. That same year, the Iraqi parliament passed the Deprivation of Stateless Jews of Their Property Law aimed at Jews who had renounced their citizenship, a pre-condition for emigration. A series of bombings of Jewish institutions and more laws that limited their freedom persuaded the remaining 6,000 Iraqi Jews to leave in the early 1950s. As a result, an estimated 300,000 Iraqi Jews and their descendants now live in Israel and 40,000 elsewhere.

A liar and an idiot.