Why they hate us....

[chaver4u2]

Chaver,
You know, I remember from the news that the EU had suspended aid, even before Hamas won, because it was going towards forming armed protection forces, when the EU could see no reason for another such force in the Palestinian territories.

You can say that the standards of accountability in which the EU holds the Palestinians who manage the aid are low. But no European country really has funding

as their agenda. The idea for the aid is to help Palestinians stand on their feet, so they can function more like a normal country and increase the chances of this conflict to end.

From my experience here in Greece, EU money is mismanaged when there are well organised groups to absorb it quickly. For example, here the civil engineers are better established than the environmentalists. So, quite a lot of the EU funds for the environment ended up on road construction. Of course now we are paying the fines…

So I think that the “bad guys” among the Palestinians are stronger and better organised than those who could really use the aid for its intended purpose. That is how the money ends up in the wrong hands. I think.

I am amazed you are writing from the sunken island Ἀτλαντὶς νῆσος. How do you do that? For centuries people have been looking for this disappeared island, and, whamm….here you are writing from the deep depths of the Mediterranean. Is it as nice as Plato wrote? I see you even have satellite TV. I am impressed. Enlighten us. What are the coordinates of Atlantis?

The problem with EU money is: there is no accountability from the PA. Arafat was always very upset when people questioned his honesty: HE as President (as he loved to call himself) was capable enough to administer the millions that were flowing to the PA. Result: he became the 12th richest man in 2003, beating Saddam Hussein to it (in spite of the latter's wealth obtained from the UN’s Money, sorry, “Food” for Oil Program).

After having suffered too much and too long from the 1973 oil embargo, and having been the longest and most fervent ally of Israel since 1948, Holland became after 1973 the most progressive Pali supporter, doling out the most free money per capita. In fact, in terms of total money donated (wasted) the Dutch are number 3.

From 1948 till 2000 the Palis have received more money per capita then all other refugees in the world put together. Besides that, they are the only refugees in the world that have kept the status “refugee” for almost 60 years.

But since Hamas forced itself upon the Palestinians (popularly called, by people like Dhimmy Carter, by means of a “fair” democratic election), the money available for poor Palis is still ending up in the hands of their leadership.

Even aid-in-kind is lining the pockets of the PA scumbags, whether Hamas or Fatah, they are all the same. Dialysis machines and tons of medicine donated recently by Sweden, Holland and Israel (yes, Israel) ended up in no time on the black market in Cairo. And the CNN keeps on broadcasting their tearjerkers from deprived Pali hospitals.

More than 60% of the $113 million Holland had donated to build Gaza harbor, Karni industrial park, and the airport, has ended up in Arafat’s pockets, either through direct siphoning off or through ridiculous prices his own companies charged for trucks, cranes, cement, bricks, wood and fasteners. We all know what happened: when Israeli patrol boats were shot at from semi-finished Gaza harbor, they shot back, so now the harbor is no harbor no more. The same happened to part of the airport. Karni the Palis destroyed themselves, as they destroyed every greenhouse and pumping system we Israelis left behind in Gaza.

I am afraid that the EU, UN, US and Japanese monies will continue to flow the way it has always flowed: into the wrong hands. If not now, then tomorrow.

[katerina]

How is Ἀτλαντὶς νῆσος? Well, its a little wet… Nice and quiet though. Everything moves slowly here.

I wasn’t aware of the extent of the corruption in the PA. When it is so widespread, I think we can talk of a culture of corruption. This seems to be common in many developing countries. Nigeria - if I am not mistaken - is sitting on the world’s biggest oil reserves, yet the children there still die of malaria.

I think the antidote to such a culture of corruption, is democracy, in the real sense of the word. I mean when people are informed, participate, and exercise their political thinking. It looks like this is still missing from Palestinian society.

It might sound crazy, but I am really optimistic about Palestine though. I think in the long run, it can really work and be a successful country. Others have made it, why not the Palestinians?

[andak01]

Agreed
Roots of this hate toward Jews are based on kuran (surats from Medina and hadiths) Muslims always show people peaceful early surats from Meca
Unfortunately, islamic tradition state that these surats have been abrogated by later medina ones That allow Muslims to project their double face Janus like behaviour Pubicly ,they support ealy peaceful surats while spreading jihad thru later ones Make no mistake,muhamed was the perfect terrorist and revered as a perfect man by more than 1 billion people
THAT IS THE PROBLEM....

Muslims, whether extremists or not never made any secret of what jihad is about. The lesser jihad is about defending ones religion from an outside threat. Just like any other concept, this one has been heavily abused in the past and in the present by self-serving people. The Muslim extremist version of preemptive self-defense is to attack the West before being attacked, to terrorize before being terrorized, not in any way related to a true defensive posture. And of course, imperialism, or in this case Ottomaniacal imperialism has a long history of employing the word defense to describe what can only be an attack. The entire Roman Empire from the time of the Sabines goes back to the preemptive concept. It is a concept which rattles the stability of the world rather than stablizing it and which is of detriment to anyone not at the top of the power chain within the group which employs it. No nation or group can feel itself safe from another nation or group which bases attacks not on agreed upon international standards; but upon its own whims. Powerful empires and crime syndicates etc. have all been destroyed by such hubris. The Islamist of today are acting more like crime syndicates than empires and their final destruction will happen the same day that all organized crime is permanently defeated. That war on crime was established decades if not centuries ago and like the war on poverty or the war on drugs, it has its own industry and not a lot else to recommend it. The answer to all of these wars is the manner in which we raise our children.

[angel]

Hi I been watching this forum for some time and decided to join. I am dumfounded at how the hate for Israel
Started in Egypt way back in bc before mosses led them in the wilds for 40 years. And today the hate is still there it seemed to be implanted with something no one still don’t know quite sure what it is. If I remember my history right. Back in Egypt. The belief of the Jews was hated because god chose them as his people. So what do you think. Its still here. This must be the reason because that’s the reason the hate started and went on every generation to this day. i think thats a lame reason to hate israel but its not what i think its dates way back to the begining. what did the haters of israel do. grow it?

[bararallu]

I think it has more to do with Pre Christian Hellenes than any other nation actually. We were the only population in the Near East that they could fully culturally colonize. Read up on Hanukkah for the general reasons. In fact we sort of colonized them, they are all Christian, a religion started by Jews.

[angel]

i cant get a post to tech suport
so i have to find out why here. when i make a new post i get a message telling me i dont have access to this option or my connection was disabeld. but i can post here. why can i post here and no place else

[Mediocrates]

check your visitor's messages.

[angel]

ok now let me see...
what message. and if all i can do is reply in this place here now how can i get help to ask what goes on if my input is blocked in the rest of the forum. why am i on trial. i will not be treeted this way take me a is or delete my account and i dont want answers from you your just another member this is posted here because i cant post or get help elsewhere in this forum and i will not play this game. if i got some kind of answer from somone in charge of this forum ill listen so how about some answers no one explained anything to me yet and when i try to go to rules or tech suport i get a message telling me i dont have rights to this option whatever. hey. i dont need this BS. otherwise just talk to thin air

[Mediocrates]

Ok let's try this. Are you talking about creating new threads or are you talking about posting generally? If your question is about creating new threads you have to accumulate a number of posts first - fewer than 20 I believe. Then you can issue new threads. If your question is about posting generally that's a technical problem. What are you seeing and can you describe it?

[sid]

I think Jews are some of the best people...very peaceful...(atleast the jews that we have in India).