The Final Clash: Islam and Christianity

[savvy]

Summary Of Comparisons Between The Islamic And Biblical Narrative Of The End-Times


• Bible: The Antichrist is an unparalleled political, military and religious leader that will that emerge in the last-days.

• Islam: The Mahdi is an unparalleled political, military and religious leader that will emerge in the last-days.

• Bible: the False Prophet is a secondary prominent figure that will emerge in the last-days who will support the Antichrist.

• Islam: the Muslim Jesus is a secondary prominent figure that will emerge in the last-days to support the Mahdi.

• Bible: The Antichrist and the False Prophet together will have a powerful army that will do great damage to the earth in an effort to subdue every nation and dominate the World.

• Islam: The Mahdi and the Muslim Jesus will have a powerful army that will attempt to control every nation of the earth and dominate the World.

• Bible: The False Prophet is described essentially as a dragon in lamb’s clothing.

• Islam: The Muslim Jesus literally comes bearing the name of the one that the world knows as “The Lamb of God: Jesus Christ.” Yet the Muslim Jesus comes to murder all those who do not submit to Islam.

• Bible: The Antichrist and the False Prophet establish a New World Order.

• Islam: The Mahdi and the Muslim Jesus establish a New World Order.

• Bible: The Antichrist and the False Prophet institute new laws for the whole earth.

• Islam: The Mahdi and the Muslim Jesus institute Islamic law all over the earth.

• Bible: The Antichrist is said to “change the times.”

• Islam: It is quite certain that if the Mahdi established Islam all over the earth, he would discontinue the use of Saturday and Sunday as the weekend or days of rest but rather Friday, the holy day of Islam. Also, he would most certainly eliminate the Gregorian calendar (A.D.), and replace it with the Islamic calendar (A. H.) as is used in every Islamic country.

• Bible: The Antichrist and the False Prophet will both be powerful religious leaders who will attempt to institute a universal world religion.
• Islam: The Mahdi and the Muslim Jesus will institute Islam as the only religion in the earth.

• Bible: The Antichrist and the False Prophet will execute anyone who does not submit to their world religion.

• Islam: Likewise, the Mahdi and the Muslim Jesus will execute anyone who does not submit to Islam.


• Bible: The Antichrist and the False Prophet will specifically use beheading as the primary means of execution for non-conformists.

• Islam: The Mahdi and the Muslim Jesus will use the Islamic practice of beheading for executions.


• Bible: The Antichrist and the False Prophet will have a specific agenda to kill as many Jews as possible.

• Islam: The Mahdi and the Muslim Jesus will kill as many Jews as is possible until only a few are left hiding behind rocks and trees.


• Bible: The Antichrist and the False Prophet will attack to conquer and seize Jerusalem.

• Islam: The Mahdi and the Muslim Jesus will attack to re-conquer and seize Jerusalem for Islam.


• Bible: The Antichrist will set himself up in the Jewish temple as his seat of authority.

• Islam: The Mahdi will establish the Islamic Caliphate from Jerusalem.


• Bible: The False Prophet is said to do many miracles to deceive as many as possible into supporting the Antichrist.

• Islam: The Mahdi himself is said to control the weather and the crops. His face is said to glow. We can also assume that since Jesus is viewed as having been empowered by Allah to work miracles when he was here on earth the first time, he will most likely be expected to continue to do so when he returns.


• Bible: The Antichrist is described as riding on a white horse in the Book of Revelation

• Islam: The Mahdi is described as riding on a white horse (ironically from the same verse).


• Bible: The Antichrist is said to make a peace treaty with Israel for seven years.

• Islam: The Mahdi is said to make a peace treaty through a Jew (specifically a Levite) for exactly seven years.

• Bible: Jesus the Jewish Messiah will return to defend the Jews in Israel from a military attack from a vast coalition of nations led by the Antichrist and the False Prophet.

• Islam: The Dajjal, the Islamic Antichrist will gain a great Jewish following and claim to be Jesus Christ and fight against the Mahdi and the Muslim Jesus.


• Bible: The antichrist spirit specifically denies the most unique and central doctrines of Christianity, namely the trinity, the incarnation and the substitutionary death of Jesus on the cross.

• Islam: Islam doctrinally and spiritually specifically denies the most unique and central doctrines of Christianity, namely the trinity, the incarnation and the substitutionary death of Jesus on the cross.

• Bible: The primary warning of Jesus and the Apostle Paul was to warn Christians of the abundance of deceit and deception in the last-days.

• Islam: Islam is perhaps the only religion in the earth that practices deceit as one of its tools to assist its own ascendancy. It actually has a specific doctrine which allows and even calls for deception to be used to achieve its desired end.


• Bible: The specific nations pictured in the Bible as being part of the final empire of the Antichrist are all Islamic nations.

• Islam: All Muslims are commanded to give their allegiance to The Mahdi as the final Caliph and Imam (leader) of Islam.


• Bible: From the Bible and History we learn that the final Antichrist empire will be a revived version of the Empire that succeeds the Roman Empire

• Islam: The Empire that succeeded the Roman/Byzantine Empire was the Islamic Ottoman Empire

• Bible: When Antichrist emerges, there will already be some form of system in place that will be poised to receive him as a Savior and to give allegiance to him.

• Islam: is already the second largest religion and will at present growth rates become the largest religion within a few decades. Islam is awaiting the coming of the Mahdi with a universal anticipation.

[Agnosthiest]

Can you provide an islamic link which supports your claims here about the Mahdi?

[Mediocrates]

It sounds like European hockey with an insurmountable 0-0 tie.

[Achihud]

It sounds like European hockey with an insurmountable 0-0 tie.

This is the penalty shoot-out I was talking about Medio, although you have a point with the 0-0 tie. Most of the shots are aimed wide and over the stakes. Some of them are heading for the net but then there's a goalkeeper that can save the ball.

[savvy]

Can you provide an islamic link which supports your claims here about the Mahdi?

http://al-islam.org/mahdi/nontl/Toc.htm

[Verdan]

But you must consider that there is no such thing like mahdi in the Quran.

[Bloodnut]

== But you must consider that there is no such thing like mahdi in the Quran.

Nor is there any teaching that God loves all humankind equally. Nor is there any guarantee that enemies should be loved.

But reformist Muslims like to pretend that this is "Islamic" anyway.

[Verdan]

== But you must consider that there is no such thing like mahdi in the Quran.

Nor is there any teaching that God loves all humankind equally. Nor is there any guarantee that enemies should be loved.

But reformist Muslims like to pretend that this is "Islamic" anyway.

Does God love the Pharesees, did Jesus love them? Didnt he threaten them with Hell? So what does hell stands for? Dont force yourself to love everybody. Christianity is against the nature of life. You dont have to kill your enemy but noone can force you to love them. Beyond religion it takes away your personality...

[Bloodnut]

Does God love the Pharesees, did Jesus love them?

Yes.

Didnt he threaten them with Hell? So what does hell stands for?

Hell is separation from God. It is a choice humans make for themselves, it isn't a threat.

But back to the issue...

Islam teaches that God hates all non-Muslims. The Bible teaches that God loves everyone. Jesus came and died for the world. He loved everyone in it.

[Alfred E Neuman]

I used to be fairly open minded about the teaching of Islam. However, the Koran specifically says that Jesus is NOT the Son of God. Therefore it is a false book in my view.

Not that Muslims are evil or anything like that.

But I cannot believe in a book that specifically says what it says about Jesus. You can have 49 truths and 1 lie to make the whole thing a lie.

Is the Koran much better than what was before? Yes indeed. Are most Muslims good people? Also yes indeed.

But if there is one MAJOR falsehood, then carefully re-look at the whole book.

Assuming it has been translated correctly from what Muhammed taught.

[1.5 million]

I used to be fairly open minded about the teaching of Islam. However, the Koran specifically says that Jesus is NOT the Son of God. Therefore it is a false book in my view.

My son's school mathmatics book says nothing about Jesus being the son of god - is it also a "false book"?

Not that Muslims are evil or anything like that.

But I cannot believe in a book that specifically says what it says about Jesus. You can have 49 truths and 1 lie to make the whole thing a lie.

The Torah says nothing about Jesus...why do you believe in jesus anyway...on what basis? (Jesus loves you yes I know)...Because "the bible tells you so"...Is this truly sufficient proof for you to say that other beliefs are "lies"? I for one see no evidence whatsoever of the exisistance of any person (and less so of any god dressed as a person) named Jesus - the whole mythology has been taken from a number of other mythologies and built very cleverly (I must admit)....anyway sure has you fooled...

Is the Koran much better than what was before? Yes indeed. Are most Muslims good people? Also yes indeed.

Any census data to support these claims or do you just know most Muslims (not that I dispute these claims...just your knowing such...and I don't get it - the Koran is better now then it used to be? What do you get a free spy whistle in each one?

But if there is one MAJOR falsehood, then carefully re-look at the whole book.

Assuming it has been translated correctly from what Muhammed taught.

I'm thinking you probably don't believe in the Invisible Pink Pony...no didn't think so...well I know better...(prove me wrong...)

[andak01]

Islam teaches that God hates all non-Muslims. The Bible teaches that God loves everyone. Jesus came and died for the world. He loved everyone in it.

Genesis
17:14 And the uncircumcised man child whose flesh of his foreskin is not circumcised, that soul shall be cut off from his people; he hath broken my covenant.

19:24 Then the LORD rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the LORD out of heaven;

38:10 And the thing which he did displeased the LORD: wherefore he slew him also.

Exodus
4:24 And it came to pass by the way in the inn, that the LORD met him, and sought to kill him.

11:5 And all the firstborn in the land of Egypt shall die, from the first born of Pharaoh that sitteth upon his throne, even unto the firstborn of the maidservant that is behind the mill; and all the firstborn of beasts.
11:6 And there shall be a great cry throughout all the land of Egypt, such as there was none like it, nor shall be like it any more.

32:27 And he said unto them, Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, Put every man his sword by his side, and go in and out from gate to gate throughout the camp, and slay every man his brother, and every man his companion, and every man his neighbour.
32:28 And the children of Levi did according to the word of Moses: and there fell of the people that day about three thousand men.

Leviticus
10:2 And there went out fire from the LORD, and devoured them, and they died before the LORD.

23:30 And whatsoever soul it be that doeth any work in that same day, the same soul will I destroy from among his people.

Numbers
11:1 And when the people complained, it displeased the LORD: and the LORD heard it; and his anger was kindled; and the fire of the LORD burnt among them, and consumed them that were in the uttermost parts of the camp.

11:33 And while the flesh was yet between their teeth, ere it was chewed, the wrath of the LORD was kindled against the people, and the LORD smote the people with a very great plague.

1 Samuel
6:19 And he smote the men of Bethshemesh, because they had looked into the ark of the LORD, even he smote of the people fifty thousand and threescore and ten men: and the people lamented, because the LORD had smitten many of the people with a great slaughter

23:2 Therefore David enquired of the LORD, saying, Shall I go and smite these Philistines? And the LORD said unto David, Go, and smite the Philistines, and save Keilah.


So much for the loving, gentle Lord of the Bible. Now how about tolerant Jesus of the New Testament?


John
8:24 I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

Luke
10:14 But it shall be more tolerable for Tyre and Sidon at the judgment, than for you.
10:15 And thou, Capernaum, which art exalted to heaven, shalt be thrust down to hell. BOM: 2 Nephi 9:34, 36, 28:15
10:16 He that heareth you heareth me; and he that despiseth you despiseth me; and he that despiseth me despiseth him that sent me.

Acts
3:23 And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people.

2 Thessalonians
1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/

[Bloodnut]

Ya know, the thing that I find most distasteful about Muslim apologists is their anti-intellectual approach to apologetics. I mean they absolutely refuse to address the problems in their own faith, and instead, almost always resort to this ridiculous “your scriptures say that too” bunk.

What they refuse to do is allow for differences between the Bible and the Quran. They are apparently too dim-witted to realize that the bible is not understood by Jews and Christians as the Quran is understood by Muslims. I have stated this perhaps a dozen times but it seems to fly completely over their heads. The Quran is timeless. It does not apply to one period in time. It applies throughout eternity. It is considered uncreated. However the Bible is a recorded history, much of which is probably not accurate anyway. Further, Christ taught in parables. This is universally accepted as truth by virtually all biblical scholars. This upsets Muslim apologists, no doubt, because it takes away their favorite tactic of doding arguments with this “your scripture says it too” nonsense.

Despite andak01’s wishes, Christians get to decide what the New Testament is saying, and no Christian on the planet interprets the verses as andak01 would have them interpret them. This throws a wrench in his entire argument which is nothing more than a straw man. By contrast, the Quran is not open for interpretation. The ahadith were provided for that purpose, and the interpretations therein have been established in Islam for many centuries. Only now, once Western civilization has influenced a handful of Muslims who want to move towards a more tolerant and humane society, are attempts being made to reinterpret what cannot be reinterpreted.

And last but not least, andak01 has not even begun to touch the real argument with a ten foot pole. The Quran nowhere mentions God loving all humankind. The Bible does. Instead of addressing what the Quran doesn’t say, he tries to pull a 180 on the discussion and focus on what the Bible says sometimes, context be damned. Andak01 is so desperate for references that seem to imply violence that he’s had to throw in some Book of Mormon passages in the mix.

A just God who punishes those who willfully sin against him, is not in dispute, as this is common in all major religions. Punishment does not mean love is not involved. Only in the Muslim mind is this true. Andak01 is obfuscating and avoiding the argument. The question is whether or not the Quran teaches God loves all of humankind. That answer is a resounding NO. The Bible on the other hand, teaches the opposite. The intermittent acts of castigation for sinners don’t change this fact.

Love verses in the Bible– 700 and in the Quran - 70
Forgiveness verses in the Bible – 200 and in the Quran – 82

[Verdan]

Genesis
17:14 And the uncircumcised man child whose flesh of his foreskin is not circumcised, that soul shall be cut off from his people; he hath broken my covenant.

19:24 Then the LORD rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the LORD out of heaven;

38:10 And the thing which he did displeased the LORD: wherefore he slew him also.

Exodus
4:24 And it came to pass by the way in the inn, that the LORD met him, and sought to kill him.

11:5 And all the firstborn in the land of Egypt shall die, from the first born of Pharaoh that sitteth upon his throne, even unto the firstborn of the maidservant that is behind the mill; and all the firstborn of beasts.
11:6 And there shall be a great cry throughout all the land of Egypt, such as there was none like it, nor shall be like it any more.

32:27 And he said unto them, Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, Put every man his sword by his side, and go in and out from gate to gate throughout the camp, and slay every man his brother, and every man his companion, and every man his neighbour.
32:28 And the children of Levi did according to the word of Moses: and there fell of the people that day about three thousand men.

Leviticus
10:2 And there went out fire from the LORD, and devoured them, and they died before the LORD.

23:30 And whatsoever soul it be that doeth any work in that same day, the same soul will I destroy from among his people.

Numbers
11:1 And when the people complained, it displeased the LORD: and the LORD heard it; and his anger was kindled; and the fire of the LORD burnt among them, and consumed them that were in the uttermost parts of the camp.

11:33 And while the flesh was yet between their teeth, ere it was chewed, the wrath of the LORD was kindled against the people, and the LORD smote the people with a very great plague.

1 Samuel
6:19 And he smote the men of Bethshemesh, because they had looked into the ark of the LORD, even he smote of the people fifty thousand and threescore and ten men: and the people lamented, because the LORD had smitten many of the people with a great slaughter

23:2 Therefore David enquired of the LORD, saying, Shall I go and smite these Philistines? And the LORD said unto David, Go, and smite the Philistines, and save Keilah.


So much for the loving, gentle Lord of the Bible. Now how about tolerant Jesus of the New Testament?


John
8:24 I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

Luke
10:14 But it shall be more tolerable for Tyre and Sidon at the judgment, than for you.
10:15 And thou, Capernaum, which art exalted to heaven, shalt be thrust down to hell. BOM: 2 Nephi 9:34, 36, 28:15
10:16 He that heareth you heareth me; and he that despiseth you despiseth me; and he that despiseth me despiseth him that sent me.

Acts
3:23 And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people.

2 Thessalonians
1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/

That' what I am talking about...

[Verdan]

Islam teaches that God hates all non-Muslims.

In fact God says about the non-muslims in the Quran that they became corrupted and fell into dispute among themselves. He criticises some Jews just like Jesus did to the Pharesees. You know the story in the Bible; a Jewish man donates some little money in the temple and he is so arrogant but then a poor humble lady donates all she got. So Jesus criticises this rich man and praises the poor lady etc etc. In the Quran God criticises some Jews the same way, it says; some of them are fond of money and mean, they want to live 1000 years, etc etc. Also in Quran God praises the Christians saying that they are humble, loving and they are closer to the muslims etc, etc.

I am only giving these for information. In fact I know that there is great contradiction in Quran. Because it also commands to fight with them and to take tribute. So there is a great difference in Quran's beginning and the end. In the beginning it is wiser, peaceful but in the end it prescribes war, violence etc. It must be discussed.

But there is one important point. In fact in the religious context, Islam is more hope giving compared to Christianity. Because in Islam even tough you are a Christian or a Jew if you believe in One God you will be saved, but in Christianity if you don't believe that Jesus died for our sins you canNOT be saved...